[20focusstdriver17]

and post #1 lol

Mustang = 60mm / Mustang w MaxBore = 62mm / BBK = 65mm / FP = 67mm

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Does the BBK require the wire extension or is the plug in the proper orientation?

 

[nicklulu]

Does the BBK require the wire extension or is the plug in the proper orientation?

Any TB upgrade other than the bore requires the wire extension.

 

[White-RS2]

So the BBK is a bit of a bargain compared to the beautifully finished / engineered FP throttle

As for my other question -
Has anyone published any Mid Range and High Range torque and power figures, on a before and after fitment to see the difference and your comments on drivability and pick up would be really awesome

 

[20focusstdriver17]

So the BBK is a bit of a bargain compared to the beautifully finished / engineered FP throttle

As for my other question -
Has anyone published any Mid Range and High Range torque and power figures, on a before and after fitment to see the difference and your comments on drivability and pick up would be really awesome

Indeed, except the FP TB is really sharp looking and an actual Ford Performance part!

Also, see post # 266

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Dont know if I would call it a "bargain" for the $89 difference in price??


FP TB = $588.89

Ford Performance Mustang 70mm Billet Throttle Body M-9926-M2371 (15-17 Mustang EcoBoost) - Free Shipping

BBK 65 = $499.99

Mustang Ecoboost Throttle Body 65MM (15-19)

 

[nicklulu]

I'll pay the $88.90 difference.

 

[20focusstdriver17]

I'll pay the $88.90 difference.

So would I!! For some reason I previously thought the pricing was much higher but i think that was the Ford Performance catalog price. I know Levitown Ford is really good with discounting FP prodiucts as Ive already purchased parts from them but never looked at the American Muscle website.

 

[morbid]

So the BBK is a bit of a bargain compared to the beautifully finished / engineered FP throttle

As for my other question -
Has anyone published any Mid Range and High Range torque and power figures, on a before and after fitment to see the difference and your comments on drivability and pick up would be really awesome

I think this is the best comparison so far. I really wish I could have done back-to-back dynos, and done more than one run. Something goofy is going on in the low end on this run, but I think the mid and high range is probably a good comparison.

Throttle Body Thread

How much do they charge for dyno and when are you going?

www.focusrs.org

 

[big jim]

I think this is the best comparison so far. I really wish I could have done back-to-back dynos, and done more than one run. Something goofy is going on in the low end on this run, but I think the mid and high range is probably a good comparison.

Throttle Body Thread

How much do they charge for dyno and when are you going?

www.focusrs.org

if it was 30 degrees warmer and you still ended up with 9 more whp...that's a very good thing.

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Picking up the Maxbore later so decided to get the Cobb cold side pipe ready for install. I was going to use the gold tape i have but decided to use some silver non adhesive 1.5 mm heat reflective insulation instead so it would be easier to remove later if needed. I could always wrap the gold tape over the silver material.

Ill post some pics and measurements of the Maxbore 2.3 TB later or tomorrow!

 

[morbid]

Hah, I was planning on doing that too

I was going to get a new intercooler, and while installing that, adjust my cold-side pipe so it's not contacting stuff. I figured while I'm doing that, I might as well pull the pipe and wrap it with gold tape.

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Maxbore arrived and is looking good!

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Y

 

[axelr]

if it was 30 degrees warmer and you still ended up with 9 more whp...that's a very good thing.

9 ponies on the dyno? For real? Hmm, interesting.

“I'd guesstimate a 65mm throttle that is straight-through all the way is worth ~10hp give or take over the stock throttle, both with 2.5" hard pipes on the stock turbo” - me 😎

So we land right on what we had already guessed back in February 2021, and it picks up past 5000, something I had also separately guessed. Cool.

Note that I don’t disagree with Randy or Adam saying you can keep the stock piping and throttle to 500hp and beyond. What they are really saying is - with a big turbo - you can boost away the pressure drop incurred in the piping/throttle and get the power figure regardless.

This is true but they must do so by working the turbo harder than necessary, increasing all the drawbacks (lag, charge temperature, and backpressure) resulting in an ultimately slower car than it could be on the road.

The dynamic nature of a turbocharged engine (the response to an increase in demand from the driver, or the response after a gear change) cannot be seen on a dyno chart, and when you are stuck with a particular turbo (either by choice or by regulation) removing restrictions to minimize pressure drops all along provides a tangible benefit to maximize the use of the flow you have, as guessed by my back of the envelope estimations and independently confirmed by dyno testing above.

PFA: the BBK in-situ, seen from below when I swapped my alternator last weekend:

 

[big jim]

9 ponies on the dyno? Hmm, interesting.

“I'd guesstimate a 65mm throttle that is straight-through all the way is worth ~10hp give or take over the stock throttle, both with 2.5" hard pipes on the stock turbo” - me 😎

So we land right on what we had already guessed back in February 2021, and it picks up past 5000, something I had also separately guessed at the time. Cool.

The BBK in-situ, seen from below when I swapped my alternator last weekend:
View attachment 362798

but he also added e30 tune...so..?

my car reacts to intake temps 1 to 1.
if its 90 degrees = 390-400 hp
if its 50 degrees = 430-440 hp

either his e30 tune boosted him 35-40 hp..
or the e30 tune was good for 25 hp and the TB was good for another 9 or 10 hp.
maybe we'll will never know...🤔

 

[nicklulu]

I just like it to breath better

 

[morbid]

but he also added e30 tune...so..?

my car reacts to intake temps 1 to 1.
if its 90 degrees = 390-400 hp
if its 50 degrees = 430-440 hp

either his e30 tune boosted him 35-40 hp..
or the e30 tune was good for 25 hp and the TB was good for another 9 or 10 hp.
maybe we'll will never know...🤔

Yeah, I wish I could have managed just to do a before/after with the throttle body... but that would have cost more than I had already spent on the new parts, and for the range of ethanol maps I was getting that day.

The way I figure it, is it's old school turbo stuff. The easier the turbo can breath, the more efficient it can be. The downside is that if you go too big it can negatively affect low RPM (before any boost), because you'll loose some NA velocity of the air... as well as potentially introducing lag. It looked like I didn't loose any low RPM power (maybe even gained some), I'm not sure. There did appear to be a slight dip at ~4000-4700rpm.

I would be curious to see before/after dynos for someone with a built engine and big turbo, for swapping to a larger throttle body. I'd imagine there would be a decent difference, and the turbo might even run cooler.

What I've gleaned from this site is that the OE turbo tends to burn up around 440whp, so letting it breath easier should also let the turbo last longer. I'm sure 400+whp is well outside the OE turbo's efficiency range anyways, maybe even lower than that... figuring the turbo was probably optimal for the ~270whp stock power.

Anyways, I think the car has plenty of power in low and mid-range for driving around town. I'd sacrifice some for the mid-high to upper range, where it normally is during autocrossing. I'd actually be curious what our little 2.3L (tuned) would do on a dyno without the turbo.

 

[20focusstdriver17]

Dont forget you can always use Virtual Dyno and TorquePro to get an idea of changes in HP/TQ if not using an actual shop dyno! This is a basically free alternative and while it may not be as accurate as a real dyno for wheel hp/tq numbers you should be able to at least gather enough data to show any differences between the TB's. I will be doing before and after logs using the TQPro app and posting the data. The problem with using the MX+/TorquePro vs. the Cobb AP for logs has been the BT connection speed misses a lot of changing data and when transferring to a log in datazap it looks like crap but now that I also have the wired OBDLink EX Im hoping this will resolve that issue by using it wired to my Laptop. Fingers crossed that it will now be as fast as a Cobb AP!

 

[big jim]

I will be doing before and after logs using the TQPro app and posting the data.

just please do in same temps