Ford Focus RS Forum banner
1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
943 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
With more people doing built engines along with bigger turbo kits, the ability to run more than 29 psi of boost safely will become a necessity. I'm personally running the 4 bar unit from Omni Power and it's been working great. The part number I'm using is OMN MAP-MUS-4BR

It should look like this.

Auto part Automotive window part Sensor


Here's the linearization data for it. The row in white is voltage. The row in green is manifold pressure in millibar. Saves you from having to search for it online.

Black Green Night Darkness Light
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,124 Posts
With more people doing built engines along with bigger turbo kits, the ability to run more than 29 psi of boost safely will become a necessity. I'm personally running the 4 bar unit from Omni Power and it's been working great. The part number I'm using is OMN MAP-MUS-4BR

It should look like this.

View attachment 256922

Here's the linearization data for it. The row in white is voltage. The row in green is manifold pressure in millibar. Saves you from having to search for it online.

View attachment 256930
Thanks for posting that. Do you think the sensor on the IC should be upgraded too? Both sensors look identical but on my car they have different engineering numbers. The one on the intake manifold is BV61-94479-AA and the one on the IC is EL8A-94479-AA.

The diagram that the dealer uses doesn't have any information for the one on the IC. And when we found the actual part number for it, Ford doesn't show it as even being a part that goes on the RS. But I ordered it anyway and it came with the same engineering number (EL8A-94479-AA) and it works.

Yes, I broke mine when I swapped the IC. :facepalm:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
943 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for posting that. Do you think the sensor on the IC should be upgraded too? Both sensors look identical but on my car they have different engineering numbers. The one on the intake manifold is BV61-94479-AA and the one on the IC is EL8A-94479-AA.

The diagram that the dealer uses doesn't have any information for the one on the IC. And when we found the actual part number for it, Ford doesn't show it as even being a part that goes on the RS. But I ordered it anyway and it came with the same engineering number (EL8A-94479-AA) and it works.

Yes, I broke mine when I swapped the IC. :facepalm:
I didn't upgrade the IC sensor. The Syvecs is currently configured to only reference the one on the manifold. If I'm not mistaken (need to look at the calibration pin outs), the one in the intercooler piping is only used to get air charge temp. I imagine that the factory Bosch ECU is setup to work the same way. You'd want to use the map sensor in the plenum to make speed density calculations since it's really the one that will properly see vacuum.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SurfCfl

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,543 Posts
BTW I used bludrgn's info to purchase off EBay for $96.96 free shipping and including CA sales tax. Thanks for posting it up, Ron.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
943 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
BTW I used bludrgn's info to purchase off EBay for $96.96 free shipping and including CA sales tax. Thanks for posting it up, Ron.
No problem mate. Nice thing about the Omni Power sensor is that it's completely bolt-in to the stock location where you don't have to drill your intake manifold. Outside of all out drag cars, it's highly, highly unlikely that anyone is going to be running more than 43.5 psi of boost.

Let me know if I can help with anything else.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
182 Posts
I didn't upgrade the IC sensor. The Syvecs is currently configured to only reference the one on the manifold. If I'm not mistaken (need to look at the calibration pin outs), the one in the intercooler piping is only used to get air charge temp. I imagine that the factory Bosch ECU is setup to work the same way. You'd want to use the map sensor in the plenum to make speed density calculations since it's really the one that will properly see vacuum.
Just noticed this. The factory ECU uses both sensors for different functions.
IC sensor primarily controls turbo system and is an input to DBW control.
Manifold sensor is speed-density, DBW control, etc.

If you're using a factory ECU, upgrade both.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
With more people doing built engines along with bigger turbo kits, the ability to run more than 29 psi of boost safely will become a necessity. I'm personally running the 4 bar unit from Omni Power and it's been working great. The part number I'm using is OMN MAP-MUS-4BR

It should look like this.

View attachment 256922

Here's the linearization data for it. The row in white is voltage. The row in green is manifold pressure in millibar. Saves you from having to search for it online.

View attachment 256930
Alright so I installed this 4bar map sensor in my RS. It either goes into limp mode and the AFR is normal with a p0106 code or there’s no code and it runs unbelievably lean. No clue what to do here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Alright so I installed this 4bar map sensor in my RS. It either goes into limp mode and the AFR is normal with a p0106 code or there’s no code and it runs unbelievably lean. No clue what to do here.
Also the fitment of the sensor almost seemed wrong. The Oring is too big and will not go in as far as the stock one. Not sure if that’s normal or not.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
410 Posts
Alright so I installed this 4bar map sensor in my RS. It either goes into limp mode and the AFR is normal with a p0106 code or there’s no code and it runs unbelievably lean. No clue what to do here.
You must get a tune that specifically dials in these sensors, did you let stratified know the details of the sensors you fitted?
You will need both.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Coyote Chaser

·
Registered
Joined
·
672 Posts
The PCM needs the slope (a) and the intercept (b) in ax+b in order to use the sensor. The sensor is linearized and temperature-compensated so the output tension (“voltage”) is ratiometric already, there is no need for a linearization curve like with many analog sensors.

The TIP sensor (on the IC) must have a range that is at least equal to the range of the MAP sensor. It does not make sense to have a 400kPa MAP sensor and a 300kPa TIP sensor, unless you have a stand-alone ECU that does not use it.

The stock setup uses 2x 300kPa sensors. I use a 350kPa sensor on the intercooler as it’s the only way to do sane boost control super-close from the MAP sensor’s ceiling around 1.95-1.97bar.

http://instagr.am/p/CBXJ_E-BWYO/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
802 Posts
If your "NOT" running Syvecs you need both sensors swapping out to a 4Bar, if your Syvecs equipped you only need one 4Bar.
Not knowing this and having Syvecs, I now have a spare 4Bar on the garage shelf lol

This is the one I've been using for a couple of years now -


Hopefully that's clear as it could be :)
Wheel Sports equipment Tool Automotive tire Font
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
91 Posts
If your "NOT" running Syvecs you need both sensors swapping out to a 4Bar, if your Syvecs equipped you only need one 4Bar.
Not knowing this and having Syvecs, I now have a spare 4Bar on the garage shelf lol

This is the one I've been using for a couple of years now -


Hopefully that's clear as it could be :)
View attachment 362243
This isn't true. You can swap out the manifold sensor and leave the ic sensor stock on the factory ECU. You just have to have your sensor calibration correct in the ECU.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
672 Posts
This isn't true. You can swap out the manifold sensor and leave the ic sensor stock on the factory ECU. You just have to have your sensor calibration correct in the ECU.
This is technically correct, Ryan, but what does a increased MAP sensor range buys you when the boost pressure (not the manifold pressure) is controlled using the other sensor?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
91 Posts
This is technically correct, Ryan, but what does a increased MAP sensor range buys you when the boost pressure (not the manifold pressure) is controlled using the other sensor?
There are multiple ways to tune a vehicle. For example, you can't even upgrade the tip sensor on the ecoboost mustang without repinning the connector, so no one does it. Every mustang (exact same control logic) that I've tuned between 6-800whp on cobb have all used the factory 3 bar tip sensor. These ecu's are very complex when it comes to safeguards, and the main limiters that i use are load limiters. Personally (if i had to choose 1) I would rather have an upgraded manifold sensor over a tip sensor if I had to choose one. The reason being is the ecu's primary method of tq/load control is closing the throttle.

With all of this being said i don't want to make it seem like i am against upgrading tip sensors. I'm just simply stating it's not a requirement to upgrade both sensors for the vehicle to function or for it to make xxxwhp.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
672 Posts
There are multiple ways to tune a vehicle. For example, you can't even upgrade the tip sensor on the ecoboost mustang without repinning the connector, so no one does it. Every mustang (exact same control logic) that I've tuned between 6-800whp on cobb have all used the factory 3 bar tip sensor. These ecu's are very complex when it comes to safeguards, and the main limiters that i use are load limiters. Personally (if i had to choose 1) I would rather have an upgraded manifold sensor over a tip sensor if I had to choose one. The reason being is the ecu's primary method of tq/load control is closing the throttle.

With all of this being said i don't want to make it seem like i am against upgrading tip sensors. I'm just simply stating it's not a requirement to upgrade both sensors for the vehicle to function or for it to make xxxwhp.
BOSCH introduced that additional sensor for a reason. It helps implement strategies that mitigates some of the inherent problems of turbochargers. In the old days the throttle was actuated by the driver and the only way to control the manifold pressure at WOT was through the wastegate, a slow and laggy mechanism. The modern method completely decouples the driver from the throttle and manages the turbo speed independently from the manifold pressure. Together with a proportionally controlled dump valve this enables lag mitigation strategies that weren’t possible before. Working around the OE logic and defeating the dump valve control logic basically returns to the old days, and I’m not sure that’s a good thing. I wish I could drive each of the popular tuner’s calibrations to see how they feel in real-life sport driving.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
802 Posts
All I can add is that a few tuners - Devil Developments, Pro Cal, Matt Lewis & MSD all told me the same if its Syvecs change out one sensor if its OEM/COBB then change out the two sensors (y). After I bought two lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
91 Posts
BOSCH introduced that additional sensor for a reason. It helps implement strategies that mitigates some of the inherent problems of turbochargers. In the old days the throttle was actuated by the driver and the only way to control the manifold pressure at WOT was through the wastegate, a slow and laggy mechanism. The modern method completely decouples the driver from the throttle and manages the turbo speed independently from the manifold pressure. Together with a proportionally controlled dump valve this enables lag mitigation strategies that weren’t possible before. Working around the OE logic and defeating the dump valve control logic basically returns to the old days, and I’m not sure that’s a good thing. I wish I could drive each of the popular tuner’s calibrations to see how they feel in real-life sport driving.
There is no shaft speed sensor on the car just like there is no egt sensor on the car. All of it is modeled/inferred, and the modeling means nothing when you swap to an aftermarket turbocharger where you would require an upgraded map sensor. Also, you don't lose throttle control by not upgrading the tip sensor. These ecu's have multiple ways of locking down the throttle. it's why you see so many bad EcoBoost tunes that aren't done by people that specialize in the platform.
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top