Ford Focus RS Forum banner

1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello, all!

Current ST owner here. Really happy with my focus but I'm looking for a little bit more and I don't think the ST will deliver the way I want. Looking at making the switch. I'm hoping someone can give me a crash course to building the RS. What can you get away with on stock block? Can I just toss E30 into a stock RS and get it tuned like I can with the ST? What is a logical order for upgrades with this car? I heard you hit a wall at 400tq, sounds like an easy fix with a clutch to me but people don't seem to be treating it that way. If I want 450 or 500whp out of this thing what am I looking at to get there?

Thanks for the help!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
Hello, all!

Current ST owner here. Really happy with my focus but I'm looking for a little bit more and I don't think the ST will deliver the way I want. Looking at making the switch. I'm hoping someone can give me a crash course to building the RS. What can you get away with on stock block? Can I just toss E30 into a stock RS and get it tuned like I can with the ST? What is a logical order for upgrades with this car? I heard you hit a wall at 400tq, sounds like an easy fix with a clutch to me but people don't seem to be treating it that way. If I want 450 or 500whp out of this thing what am I looking at to get there?

Thanks for the help!
I’ll help but can u answer a few questions for me?
Why do you need 450-500tq? Is purpose to lower the power weight ratio? If so I was at 8:1 while a stock RS is 9.8:1. I didn’t touch my engine. Another scenario would be pump boost up and risk longevity since most knowledgeable engine builders will easily admit 150HP/liter is insane for an engine And more so to last 100K. Yet ford offered a warranty at near this level and people don’t care. If the needs are there go get a 2.0 solid deck block , run worse emissions, have even more horrible gas mileage (POWER IS FUEL) and crank boost. The design of the open deck in the RS is not designed for huge boost. It’s responsive, efficient , tightly packaged and relatively cheap. While passing emissions with a breeze. You can reinforce the 2.3 with deck bracing , liners , etc. but ain’t cheap which makes the 2.0 such a great swap.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WoopsPooped

·
Registered
Joined
·
154 Posts
I made the switch from a full bolt on and tuned ST to an RS. The RS in stock form is in no way as violent or hammer-like as the tuned ST. It's still faster than a Tuned and bolted on ST. The RS also has the ability to go from AWD on rails to tail happy fun mode at the press of a switch. My ST was awesome zipping through the mountains of CO and NM, but it in no way handled like an RS, they are completely different in the handling realm. The AWD means you'll stick and go instead of wheel hopping everywhere. That violent hammer feel I had with my tuned ST didn't actually give me usable power at a stop light and ran out of breath on the highway. The RS suffers much less from that with a more refined power delivery in stock form. My biggest complaints about the RS compared to the ST is that the stock wheels don't have enough sidewall, that the AWD system takes up cargo space I was used to using, and that the 350hp means my gas mileage can't hold a candle to the ST on highway trips.

The wall at 400wtq is an issue greatly increasing the odds of bending the connecting rods at any power above that. It's not an issue with the clutch, it's an issue with not having forged internals from the start.

Most Logical order would be to do a tune along with an intercooler and cat-back exhaust (for sound) all at the same time. My understanding is with those three you'll reliably make full power on the motor without breaking anything and be looking at 400whp/400wtq. There is lots of discussion on the exhaust, a downpipes isn't needed on the stock turbo. COBB's strategy is either downpipes or catback so better to leave emissions alone IMO. You could also go with water methanol injection if you wanted to keep the stock intercooler and be making safe reliable power as well. The stock intake flows well with a drop in conical filter so no need to upgrade there. The rest of the mods that the community does like replacing the recirculation valve, charge pipes, and intake are less about big performance gains and more about chasing a possible small gain somewhere in the power band while getting shiny (cool looking) and quality aftermarket parts. There is also something to be said about doing those other upgrades to future proof the motor for WMI system or big turbo.

The Ford Performance engineers didn't leave a lot on the table power wise before you need to upgrade to forged internals. If you do make the switch you won't regret it, just make sure that you get one that has had the head gasket recall completed.

Cheers and best of luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
I’ll help but can u answer a few questions for me?
Why do you need 450-500tq? Is purpose to lower the power weight ratio? If so I was at 8:1 while a stock RS is 9.8:1. I didn’t touch my engine. Another scenario would be pump boost up and risk longevity since most knowledgeable engine builders will easily admit 150HP/liter is insane for an engine And more so to last 100K. Yet ford offered a warranty at near this level and people don’t care. If the needs are there go get a 2.0 solid deck block , run worse emissions, have even more horrible gas mileage (POWER IS FUEL) and crank boost. The design of the open deck in the RS is not designed for huge boost. It’s responsive, efficient , tightly packaged and relatively cheap. While passing emissions with a breeze. You can reinforce the 2.3 with deck bracing , liners , etc. but ain’t cheap which makes the 2.0 such a great swap.
Not looking for 450tq, looking for 450whp, and whatever tq comes along with it. That said, I'm honestly just teasing the waters. I might be happy with just a FBO RS. I really wanted a big turbo for my ST because it fell on its face at 5000rpm but that doesn't seem to be an issue the RS has.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
I made the switch from a full bolt on and tuned ST to an RS. The RS in stock form is in no way as violent or hammer-like as the tuned ST. It's still faster than a Tuned and bolted on ST. The RS also has the ability to go from AWD on rails to tail happy fun mode at the press of a switch. My ST was awesome zipping through the mountains of CO and NM, but it in no way handled like an RS, they are completely different in the handling realm. The AWD means you'll stick and go instead of wheel hopping everywhere. That violent hammer feel I had with my tuned ST didn't actually give me usable power at a stop light and ran out of breath on the highway. The RS suffers much less from that with a more refined power delivery in stock form. My biggest complaints about the RS compared to the ST is that the stock wheels don't have enough sidewall, that the AWD system takes up cargo space I was used to using, and that the 350hp means my gas mileage can't hold a candle to the ST on highway trips.

The wall at 400wtq is an issue greatly increasing the odds of bending the connecting rods at any power above that. It's not an issue with the clutch, it's an issue with not having forged internals from the start.

Most Logical order would be to do a tune along with an intercooler and cat-back exhaust (for sound) all at the same time. My understanding is with those three you'll reliably make full power on the motor without breaking anything and be looking at 400whp/400wtq. There is lots of discussion on the exhaust, a downpipes isn't needed on the stock turbo. COBB's strategy is either downpipes or catback so better to leave emissions alone IMO. You could also go with water methanol injection if you wanted to keep the stock intercooler and be making safe reliable power as well. The stock intake flows well with a drop in conical filter so no need to upgrade there. The rest of the mods that the community does like replacing the recirculation valve, charge pipes, and intake are less about big performance gains and more about chasing a possible small gain somewhere in the power band while getting shiny (cool looking) and quality aftermarket parts. There is also something to be said about doing those other upgrades to future proof the motor for WMI system or big turbo.

The Ford Performance engineers didn't leave a lot on the table power wise before you need to upgrade to forged internals. If you do make the switch you won't regret it, just make sure that you get one that has had the head gasket recall completed.

Cheers and best of luck.
Thanks a ton, this is exactly what I was looking for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
Not looking for 450tq, looking for 450whp, and whatever tq comes along with it. That said, I'm honestly just teasing the waters. I might be happy with just a FBO RS. I really wanted a big turbo for my ST because it fell on its face at 5000rpm but that doesn't seem to be an issue the RS has.
Completely different beasts . The RS PULLS TO REDLINE PERIOD . Hard. The twinscroll turbo rewards revs while the single scroll ST made way too much early torque which results in Zero top end power. My RS on tracks at 140mph is pure bliss. The 14ST2 I had couldn’t hold a candle to this car in anyway. Big brother little brother , while both family one will kick the **** outta the other if needed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Completely different beasts . The RS PULLS TO REDLINE PERIOD . Hard. The twinscroll turbo rewards revs while the single scroll ST made way too much early torque which results in Zero top end power. My RS on tracks at 140mph is pure bliss. The 14ST2 I had couldn’t hold a candle to this car in anyway. Big brother little brother , while both family one will kick the **** outta the other if needed.
Alright sounds good. I think you guys sold me. I think I'll be pretty happy with just some simple bolt-ons and a tune. Can I just toss in some corn and get an ethanol tune like I can on the ST, also what is a good / common ethanol content? I run E30 in my ST, that is pretty common, what do you guys usually do?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
166 Posts
Alright sounds good. I think you guys sold me. I think I'll be pretty happy with just some simple bolt-ons and a tune. Can I just toss in some corn and get an ethanol tune like I can on the ST, also what is a good / common ethanol content? I run E30 in my ST, that is pretty common, what do you guys usually do?
Former st owner here.
Yeah upgrade path is pretty much the same as the st. Both cars like corn, with E30 blend being the most common tune. As already stated, an intercooler is helpful, and an exhaust or downpipe will free up a tiny bit of power but honestly it's mostly noise.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Former st owner here.
Yeah upgrade path is pretty much the same as the st. Both cars like corn, with E30 blend being the most common tune. As already stated, an intercooler is helpful, and an exhaust or downpipe will free up a tiny bit of power but honestly it's mostly noise.
Can I yank my intercooler off my ST and drop it into the RS? How different are they actually? Maybe I can Jimmy rig it and save some money. I've got the big ass 5.5" Depo one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
Can I yank my intercooler off my ST and drop it into the RS? How different are they actually? Maybe I can Jimmy rig it and save some money. I've got the big ass 5.5" Depo one.
I know the two share similar attributes like radiator core supports , etc. probably would work with a little love. Yes
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
I know the two share similar attributes like radiator core supports , etc. probably would work with a little love. Yes
Ok, so, I think my last big question is what model year to go for? I understand the 2018 has an LSD, is that worth the extra $4k or so if I plan on religiously tracking / AutoXing the car? I also do love the race red, might track one of those down. What are the notable differences between model years?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
830 Posts
Ok, so, I think my last big question is what model year to go for? I understand the 2018 has an LSD, is that worth the extra $4k or so if I plan on religiously tracking / AutoXing the car? I also do love the race red, might track one of those down. What are the notable differences between model years?
Ford racing over priced interior carbon bits back in 2015ish , so 2018 RS got part bin parts which needed to be put on something since they didn't sell and sat in parts bins.. Same goes for the Diff, lots of back stock so easy update to model year, plus add the fact Ford Fukd themselves and sold deffective cars, which tanked sales, so inventively they were stuck with 1000 chassis to move late into 2017. BOOM, 2018 models. These are facts. Whether or not they are worth it, I couldn't tell when I drove an 18. But this was dry pavement, not wet.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
469 Posts
I’ll help but can u answer a few questions for me?
Why do you need 450-500tq? Is purpose to lower the power weight ratio? If so I was at 8:1 while a stock RS is 9.8:1. I didn’t touch my engine. Another scenario would be pump boost up and risk longevity since most knowledgeable engine builders will easily admit 150HP/liter is insane for an engine And more so to last 100K. Yet ford offered a warranty at near this level and people don’t care. If the needs are there go get a 2.0 solid deck block , run worse emissions, have even more horrible gas mileage (POWER IS FUEL) and crank boost. The design of the open deck in the RS is not designed for huge boost. It’s responsive, efficient , tightly packaged and relatively cheap. While passing emissions with a breeze. You can reinforce the 2.3 with deck bracing , liners , etc. but ain’t cheap which makes the 2.0 such a great swap.
Just had to drop some props and a +1 for the way you phrased this. Ford made a great car here and the availability of 10yr / 100k packages made me laugh because it's almost expected to have a major costly issue somewhere in there if you're using the damn thing at all.

To each their own, seriously. If you want big power, do it. Don't let any of us stop you.
However... maybe it's my age and life situation married and approaching mid-30's, but I'm super satisfied with the car stock at this point and knowing I have that warranty fallback. I don't have any desire to street race teenagers anymore, I'm more concerned about making it home safely to my family each day.

I'm approaching 30k miles finally after 3.5 years. Had my full engine replaced by Ford (under warranty) at 26,800 so the thing is actually a baby to me at this point. No plans to tune or mod because it already does what I want it to do --- gets me to work 4-5 days a week, and lets me hit up a couple HPDE each summer without making any changes to the car.

Sorry if this reply was useless to your question, but I think this replier brings up points worth considering.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40 Posts
I have to agree with all points here, also came from an ST (2015) that I freektuned + filter, stock the RS doesn't shove you back in your seat the same way but you're definitely going faster (or about the same depending on mods)

I've also had the opportunity to drive my house mates RS which was freektuned + filter. Can confirm that gives you the shove even from down low. I'd say it compares pretty well to the difference or change felt in the ST from stock to tuned but given you have AWD, way more power, and a more linear power delivery compared to the ST.

This is the first turbo car I've owned where I truly feel like the stock power levels are adequate for what I want to do. My buddy tuned his within a year. But I don't really street race. I'm far more interested in suspension improvements and aesthetic mods, guess it takes me a while to get bored of stock power.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
175 Posts
My mods are in my sig, I was a dumbshit (maybe still am haha) and put a bunch of bolt on stuff when I first got it, nothing really worked because it did not have a tune for it and the car really had no idea it was there, i'm sure the ecu learned and adjusted a little bit but...
have 50k miles on it now, just got the Cobb AccessPort yesterday, so far only tried stage 1 ots cobb tune on 91, and holy ****! this car has livened up a lot! face hurts from smiling all the way to work today lol. can't wait to feel it after being really tuned!
I have no regrets about this car.

It handles friggin awesome, it rides like crap, it feels totally connected and just friggin RIPS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
My mods are in my sig, I was a dumbshit (maybe still am haha) and put a bunch of bolt on stuff when I first got it, nothing really worked because it did not have a tune for it and the car really had no idea it was there, i'm sure the ecu learned and adjusted a little bit but...
have 50k miles on it now, just got the Cobb AccessPort yesterday, so far only tried stage 1 ots cobb tune on 91, and holy ****! this car has livened up a lot! face hurts from smiling all the way to work today lol. can't wait to feel it after being really tuned!
I have no regrets about this car.

It handles friggin awesome, it rides like crap, it feels totally connected and just friggin RIPS
I learned really early on with the ST not to run without a tune. I'll never do it. **** the OTS maps. I'm gonna keep my AP from my ST and just have it remapped, and I'll probably buy an E30 tune before I even install any bolt-ons cause I'm not playing that game.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Top