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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
There is no bashing here, I would love a Focus RS at $35K and would buy one for me and another one for my wife. I would be the first one to say 350hp, all wheel drive, sedan, YES. But what I am not understanding is the lack of understanding from everyone else here. Ford while they may have committed to releasing the RS here, there is a couple of things that everyone has forgotten or overlooked, and maybe the forum here can chime in and help me out.

#1, Ford is not going to release a car that decimates the Mustang.
#2, Ford is not going to release a car that decimates the Mustang for less than the Mustang in the same performance class.
#3, Ford is not going to release a car that knocks on base Corvettes door for $35K. That just doesn't make business sense when they can sell it for $45K.

This is not a car for the masses. This is also not a Focus ST. Think about it, A Focus ST can be had for $26K-31K. While I am all about everything the RS could be, Ford did not get where they are by giving cars away.

The pricing on this car is likely to start somewhere around $31K-35K, without the special seats, maybe even a 2 wheel drive version, and maybe detuned version )think WRX price structure, so it is not going to come 1 car loaded. That makes no sense. Then adding Special brakes (1500-2500), adding special seats (2000, Think Focus ST), adding NAV and all those extras (2500), lets not forget special suspension tuning (1700-2500), and special leather stitching (1500), Heated interior like steering and seats (500), probably some weird option for automatic (1500), your encroaching on $50K.

$50,000 for a Fully Loaded Focus RS.

Ford cannot sell this car in its current line up for less than $45K and it make sense and not knock out the Mustang. Who here is looking at a $45K Focus RS over a World Class WRX, or EVO (proven cars), when and God bless Ford for trying cant make a reliable transmission (Ford had to replace 4 count them 4 automatic transmissions in my 2012 Focus before it hit 90,000 miles). Yes I put 90K on my Focus in less than 12 months.

At 47K, you are knocking on Low end Corvette, and Middle range Mustang. And all of you here are saying yes Ill take the $47K Focus RS over the Corvette and Mustang?

You can't buy a 300 HP WRX with all wheel drive for a $1 less than $40K. And you cant buy a 300 HP EVO (anymore) for $1 less than $40K. And now Ford is bringing the beloved Focus RS to the US (with stricter regulations than UK) for less than $40K? I don't think so.

Lest not forget, www.pumaspeed.com. For $4500 US + Vat, I can upgrade my Fiesta ST to 300 HP. And if I can do it to a Fiesta ST, I can do it to a Focus ST, or take the Motor out of the Focus ST, and put it in a Focus Sedan, and upgrade the suspension to something better than the factory would ever release to the public through Ford for $1200.
 

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First off, hello and welcome to the Forum.

I think one aspect of the Mustang that you are not considering is the fact that it is Ford's flagship muscle car and has been a huge seller ever since is was first released. While some may consider the RS over the Mustang, most die-hard Mustang enthusiasts will not jump ship and buy the FoRS. The FoRS, as great as I hope it will be, will NEVER knock out the Mustang, no matter what its selling price will be or what type of performance/handling it will have.

With all due respect, you are comparing apples to oranges here (Mustang vs FoRS).

Additionally, I honestly do not believe that a two-wheel drive version of the RS is going to be offered to lower its price. There will likely be two (possibly three) trim levels of the RS, but we have absolutely nothing indicating that a two-wheel drive version will be in the FoRS lineup. The variations will most likely be related to creature comforts, not performance. Just like the Focus ST can be had in ST1, ST2, and the ST3 trim levels. Those three trim levels are related to creature comforts like leather seats, heated seats, HID lighting, NAV, wheel color, etc., but all three trim levels of the FoST have the same engine (same power output), drive-train, suspension, wheel design & size, brakes, tires, etc.

We will have to wait for final pricing of the FoRS as it gets closer to arriving on dealership lots. I do believe that most, if not all, dealerships will mark up the FoRS MSRP.
 

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I highly doubt there will be a 2wd detuned version of the RS to lower the price point. Well there are already is technically... Its the Focus ST. I imagine the relationship between the ST and the RS will be very similar to the WRX and STI. And as far as competition with the Mustang, the only mustangs the RS will be better than will be the V6 mustang and it will be pretty evenly matched (slight edge to RS) with the ecoboost mustang. The GT will still have 100 more hp and will still out perform the RS in stock form on everything except a skid pad...
 

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First off, the Mustang and the Focus RS appeal to different buyers. There may be some cross-shopping, but it will be minimum. The Mustang appeals to an older generation and those that want the "muscle car" experience. Whereas, the RS appeals, generally, to a younger crowd that appreciates smaller cars with high horse power, sophisticated drivetrains, and technology.

The Focus RS is a global car to be manufactured in Germany and imported to the States. What you saw at the revel will be generally what you get save for a few homologation changes for each country. By making all of the changes you have listed, would be to make the car too expensive to produce.

The RS may not be a "car for the masses" but it is manufactured from components and on the same line that are used in "cars for the masses". It’s all about economies of scale. Make more of the same product, use the same components from it cheaper brethren. This reduces the production costs, and hopefully reduces the costs to, us, the consumer.

Those same economies of scale will we should see the RS come in around ~$35k, with good options, to compete directly with the Golf R and STi. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if it was $32-34k to really undercut their competitors.
 

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I doubt they will have many variations. Im betting 37k. A fully loaded ST is pushing 32 now. I bet there will be a car, with 3 options. quad coat paint, tires, track pack if even that. I bet the car will come the way it will come. And lets not forget everyone, its going to be limited production and hard to get. everyone thinks they will be able to run out and buy one for their whole family.
 

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I doubt they will have many variations. Im betting 37k. A fully loaded ST is pushing 32 now. I bet there will be a car, with 3 options. quad coat paint, tires, track pack if even that. I bet the car will come the way it will come. And lets not forget everyone, its going to be limited production and hard to get. everyone thinks they will be able to run out and buy one for their whole family.
Add options for Nav and moon roof and I think you are on to something. I doubt we will see the tiers like we do on the ST. I think there will be the base car (all with sync and the 8" screen) then just a few additional options available.
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
First off, the Mustang and the Focus RS appeal to different buyers. There may be some cross-shopping, but it will be minimum. The Mustang appeals to an older generation and those that want the "muscle car" experience. Whereas, the RS appeals, generally, to a younger crowd that appreciates smaller cars with high horse power, sophisticated drivetrains, and technology.

The Focus RS is a global car to be manufactured in Germany and imported to the States. What you saw at the revel will be generally what you get save for a few homologation changes for each country. By making all of the changes you have listed, would be to make the car too expensive to produce.

The RS may not be a "car for the masses" but it is manufactured from components and on the same line that are used in "cars for the masses". It’s all about economies of scale. Make more of the same product, use the same components from it cheaper brethren. This reduces the production costs, and hopefully reduces the costs to, us, the consumer.

Those same economies of scale will we should see the RS come in around ~$35k, with good options, to compete directly with the Golf R and STi. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if it was $32-34k to really undercut their competitors.
Is any body home? Where did you get your demographic data? The mustang is one of the best selling sports cars in the country, and it appeals to everyone except me and all ages. It is Fords #1 selling car next to the F150.

My conversation has nothing to do with stealing Mustang drivers to Focus. Who would even go there? Back in the 80's Pontiac built a Fiero that made 300 hp. It was a turbo. Because of the weight it trounced the current Corvette and GM said no.

GM was not about to let a $20,000 car put together from a scrap pile take over its flagship. This is what the conversation is about. That's why the Caddy, CTS-V is not faster than the Vette. That's why when the CTS-V and Vette both had supercharged motors, the CTS-V was using the smaller blower same motor for all intents and purposes.

Ford is not going to release a Focus that could challenge the Mustang in a road race. It's not happening. It is not about stealing potential mustang customers. They have already moved the turbo motor to the mustang in the Ecoboost. It is about tainting their flagship car, the mustang. The focus is a commuter car. Nothing more, nothing less. 350HP is not happening. While all of this is just semantics, I don't see anything over 310hp (just to swat the proverbable fly, SWX) and to keep it in perspective within the family, they will price it out of range of most. To move the car from there to here requires safety changes that are not required in Europe. That will affect the price somewhat. But if you go to Subaru's website, $26,295 gets you 268HP, all wheel drive, and high performance suspension, $28,495 gets you moonroof, and heated seats, $29,995 gets you Leather, LED headlights, and push button start, $34,495 gets you 305HP, differential upgrade and brembo brakes (a 5K jump), and $38,00 gets you better leather (theres your blue stitching, moonroof, and 18" wheels) and a car that would last a lifetime. I am not pushing Subaru here, remember I drive a Fiesta ST, which is in my opinion superior is so many ways over the Focus ST in everyway but motor. And while you may not agree, the motor press does.

The conversation is about purpose and place in the family, and price. Ford cannot sell the Focus RS for less than $40K and if it is in limited production I don't see less than $45K to $50K. Hence my point, why would anyone spend $40K on a Ford Focus? You can have a Fiesta ST, Hatchback (which everyone here wants anyway), it is a better handling car than the Focus ST will ever be, it is lighter, and you can add 100hp for less than $5K. So for $25K total out the door you have a car, that would be knocking on the Focus RS at $40K plus. You really do not need any kind of math education to understand this. And you can argue all you want, but it just goes to show that you don't know what your talking about. And make no mistake, 40-50 hp and the Fiesta ST would trounce the Focus ST on the track in weigh alone. Ford may not have known what it built when it released the Fiesta ST. I had a clue 4 years ago when the new body style came out, and I drove the standard Fiesta. I told the salesman that day, with 200hp, this car would be right as rain. Read the press. The comparison between the two completely backs me up here. SDA3 posted $37K, which would be the right pricing point, but not at 350HP. 275 to 290 makes more sense and it keeps the Focus out of Mustang territory.
 

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Lol @ this thread.
 

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Okay I can see the RS coming in one trim pretty loaded; very few options at $35K

Lunapark - I am not sure everyone wants a Fiesta ST; The RS will not have much affect on the Mustang and absolutely no decimate it. Yes, it will be more stout than the v6 or turbo, but then you have GT, Boss 302, and Shelby. I agree with COBBST you are comparing Apples to Oranges. I do not believe there will be a 2 wheel drive, even way too much torque steer to comfortably handle. And I thing you $13K of options is way too high.

Event-Horizon - I am not sure where you got your demographics, they sure don't fit me. RS appeals to me because I have always loved performance shifting cars since my first new 1970 442 when I graduated college. I went to a Taurus SHO 5-speed in 1990 then went away from Ford until 2013 with the Focus ST. Mustangs have never tripped my trigger.

I am looking forward to buying a RS and I have already contacted my Ford dealer about it ( my Jerry Reynolds rep treats me great!).
 

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$47,000 range for a new Corvette, tell me where and I will buy one. They are $56,000 before you add even one option. Not that I think many folks would cross shop a Focus with a Corvette, but I own one of each. ST & Z06, two great American Sports Cars.
 

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Right, because Ford hasn't announced that the US is getting the same car as the rest of the world, and most publications have said it will be $40k+ That's heavy sarcasm by the way.

You own an ST. So, you would know that the new Focus/Fiesta is a global platform that was designed to be sold across the world and conform to nearly all of the EU/US/Asia regulations. There is little need to make large changes to the car for each market and that will carry over to the RS. Besides that, if you take away any one of the components you've listed, the Brembro brakes, the AWD, the trick differential, its no longer an RS! All those as a whole is what makes it an RS. Ford will not be piecemealing the RS because it would not make sense. VW doesn't do it with the Golf R and Mitsu doesn't do it with the Evolution.

Go buy a mustang. It sounds like you're more offended that a Focus has a chance to keep pace with the GT than actually buying one.
 

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I think the base will be 35k, but you won't see many of them. The dealers will carry a few fully loaded ones priced between 40-45 to see how the demand is. Also, Ford isn't worried about competing within itself between the RS and the Mustang. Just my opinions.
 

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#1, Ford is not going to release a car that decimates the Mustang.
#2, Ford is not going to release a car that decimates the Mustang for less than the Mustang in the same performance class.
#3, Ford is not going to release a car that knocks on base Corvettes door for $35K. That just doesn't make business sense when they can sell it for $45K.
1. Why not? There's a huge market out there for hot hatches that's not interested in a Mustang, me being one.
2. A 2015 Chevy Corvette Stingray - 455hp/460tq ($55,000 new), A 2015 Chevy Camaro ZL1 - 580hp/556tq ($55,000 new).
3. Why would ford not want to blow away the competition, basically laughing at them?

Not really much else to say. I doubt many would buy a Focus RS for $45k+, but a lot of us will for $35k+. They'd decimate almost the entire market to save the mustangs sales?
 

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Did lunapark not watch not watch the reveal last week? Well in excess of 315 horsepower and over a 1 g of lateral grip. The damn car is getting the same tires as the GT350. This isn't 2004 anymore, 305 horsepower in a awd hot hatch just isnt enough just ask Subaru fans. Also I think its funny how lunapark says a Subaru wrx sti will last a lifetime, I guess he hasn't read about blown transmission's, rear ends and leaking valve covers. how is he pricing a new RS at 40-45 k with 280-290 hp max. Both of his rants are just full of contradiction's.
 

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OP are you just shamelessly trolling in here? Lol

Seriously not sure if you're being serious right now.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Okay I can see the RS coming in one trim pretty loaded; very few options at $35K

Lunapark - I am not sure everyone wants a Fiesta ST; The RS will not have much affect on the Mustang and absolutely no decimate it. Yes, it will be more stout than the v6 or turbo, but then you have GT, Boss 302, and Shelby. I agree with COBBST you are comparing Apples to Oranges. I do not believe there will be a 2 wheel drive, even way too much torque steer to comfortably handle. And I thing you $13K of options is way too high.

Event-Horizon - I am not sure where you got your demographics, they sure don't fit me. RS appeals to me because I have always loved performance shifting cars since my first new 1970 442 when I graduated college. I went to a Taurus SHO 5-speed in 1990 then went away from Ford until 2013 with the Focus ST. Mustangs have never tripped my trigger.

I am looking forward to buying a RS and I have already contacted my Ford dealer about it ( my Jerry Reynolds rep treats me great!).
That was a grammatical typo, not that everyone wants a Fiesta ST, everyone here keeps talking about wanting the hatchback not a saloon. I would take the saloon, and on many occasions gave serious considerations to converting the Focus Saloon I had by dropping the V6 EcoBoost out of the F150 into the Focus right up until the Chevy 2500 ran into the back of me doing 60 mph while I was stopped. It would not be the first time I have done such. I dropped a Northstar 32V DOC from a Caddy into a 1986 Pontiac Fiero. So modifying something is nothing new. The interior pictures posted here look identical to a standard focus save the back of the seats, and if you want that plastic look, you can get a set of cobra seats.

Ok, again, the 2 wheel thing was not trying to be specific, was simply conveying that there will be options. Actually it makes no sense to build a two wheel version, it would be cheaper just to offer cloth seats. When a car company says "limited production" that is to get your lips wet. Car companies do not make cars because the public wants them or because car guys send millions of letters. Car companies make cars to make money and the only reason Ford would do this is if it was black on the bottom line, Ford would not do this if they were going to lose money. While the RS is beloved in Germany, and the RS never have stepped foot in the US, Though I thought there was a Focus RS back in the 80's. By-gons. I am certain there will be people who will purchase it, and perhaps I will be one of those, but the car has to meet what I call price versus perception. In English, I have to feel like I am getting my monies worth. I drive about 6000 miles a month, and keep my cars about a year and half. So because I am in the car as much as I am, I have to have something that is fun to drive. I have spent some stupid money in the name of cars. STUPID MONEY. If the car is worth it, and within my scope of reach I will find a way to buy it, for example, $72K 2008 Corvette Z06, $90,000 2002 Trans-Am, 427 Supercharged 822RWHP. (You can see this car on prochargers gallery), $80K 2006 Pontiac GTO 1100RWHP. Why? partly because I was told it couldn't be done. You can always do it cheaper than buying it dollar for horsepower. For GM to make a 800RWHP Trans-Am they would have sold that for $130K or more.

As for the apples and oranges, I am not sure why everyone responding to this thread is struggling with the concepts presented. Ford is not going to release a car that crushes the Mustang. It has ZERO to do with whether you like Mustangs or ST's. ZERO. Ford has a reputation just like GM, just like Nissan, Just like BMW. BMW is not going to release a car that trounces the M3 for less money, just like Nissan is not going to release a car that trounces the GT-R for less money, just like GM is not going to release a car that trounces the Corvette for less money. WHY? Because those cars are the statement pieces for those companies. While I imagine all those on this forum are car guys to some extent, Ford is not bringing this car over here because all of the car guys wished it. And they are not going to sell that car over here in a position and price that takes away from their flagship. It has nothing to do with different people liking different cars. If you want a fast performance car, Ford wants you to buy the mustang. They are not going to give you an option between a mustang and a lower cost focus with a bigger boosted engine and all wheel drive for less money. What the bean counters are hoping for is someone like yourself, who doesn't like the Mustang, but wants something with some get up and go, and is willing to pay for it based on name alone. The Mustang is a muscle car, it is not a commuter like the Focus, and I can say this because the RS is unproven is US trim Different continent different regulations. Two completely different customers, and two completely different premises. One customer has nothing to do with the other. It is not comparing apples and oranges. It is comparing grapefruits and raisins. The World Class Subaru makes 305 HP and sells for $38,495. The EVO is $41K or was.

If Ford can bring the RS here make 315hp as one has stated, and sell it full boat loaded for $35K. They would not be able to keep up with demand and would steal customers from all over the place. That in demographics (marketing term), is the sweet spot for performance cars. $30K is the sweet spot for family sedans. Look at what the press has done with the Ford Focus ST. They have basically put it under their boot and shrugged at it. Not one piece of Media has had anything nice to say about it. Understeer, bad seats, overheating issues, too heavy, terrible at the track holding its line. All wheel drive does not fix this problem. A lot has to happen to fix this problem. Look at what the press has said about the Fiesta ST. It beats every car in its class including the Focus ST in every category except HP against the Focus.

This is almost a contradiction to everything I have said, with Ford building a Fiesta that trounces the Focus. I don't think Ford knew when they built it how the press would react between the two cars. If Ford had known, I think the Focus ST would be a different car. Ford didn't do anything special to make the Focus ST. They slapped a turbo on a 2.0 motor not even an Ecoboost derived motor, it was sequential fuel injected to start in 2014, slapped some bigger brakes, bigger sway bars, some really uncomfortable recaro seats, and gave it a grill. The reason the Fiesta turned out better out of the shoot, was smaller tighter chassis, Ecoboost Engine, really good brakes from a single piston which are a poor design, but function because light weight car. To compete in Europe requires so much more, and that is really where Subaru and Mitsubishi and owned the market. They didn't take something off the showroom floor and convert it, they went purpose built and it shows. If the RS came here without any modifications, perhaps, but we both know that will not be the case.

Bottom line, we will just have to wait and see. I hope your right. I really wish Ford would give us a truly performance sedan, small, agile, smart, quick, AWD, and for under $37K and for the FORD people who may be reading this SYNC SUCKS and doesn't work reliably. But I don't see that happening. Especially with Ford touting "Limited" that means dealers will want their cut and that will put car if not already over $40K then over $40K. And for apples and oranges, Ford is not going to sell anything here that trounces their Mustang, for less money. That would take money away from a car that makes Ford a lot of money and that is not happening. They will also not do anything that would end up in a magazine that trounces a mustang for less money.
 

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I think the base will be 35k, but you won't see many of them. The dealers will carry a few fully loaded ones priced between 40-45 to see how the demand is. Also, Ford isn't worried about competing within itself between the RS and the Mustang. Just my opinions.
wrong. they will be difficult to get. limited allocation. like the boss 302. id bet on it.
 

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Discussion Starter #19 (Edited)
I grew up loving Pontiacs. Building cars, and racing cars legally. I love driving fast, and I love doing it in sedans. While my Fiesta ST is a hatch, it was a departure for me from the Focus Sedan. See Above. My job caused me to change car selections. But it doesn't mean I have to not have fun driving it.

Everything about the Focus RS in design is what I like in a car or would like in a car, 300 plus HP, AWD, Stick, Sedan, Slick looking, 6 piston brakes, No Automatic (EVER). The point of the thread was to say, Ford cant sell that car here for less than $40K if it makes 350HP. Ford cant sell a car that would trounce on Mustang turf for less money and it has nothing to do with who likes mustangs. See Above for explanation. Like I said in another post, at full tilt 315Hp for $37K, you will never be able to buy one for less than $40K, if it comes in limited fashion because the dealers will want their cut. Which probably brings me to your next question, why didn't I buy the WRX. I drove that car several times, and the car feels too heavy and too big. It was quick, one of the quickest 4 cylinder cars I have driven from the factory. I also compared to the EVO which was equally quick but that car felt like it had not substance. Not a lot of metal between me and the road. Both were silly quick and handled beyond expectations. But when I get out of them, and get back in the Fiesta ST, it is the best compromise. Light weight, quick, while not silly quick, and maneuverable. It is quick and now that I have dropped those stupid factory brakes in lieu of the Wilwood setup, it feels even better shaving 22 lbs from the front end.

It would be awesome if Ford would say, we don't care about Mustang customers. All we care about are people who want high performance 4 cylinder cars. So we are bringing the Focus RS to the US, in AWD and 315+ HP configuration and we are going to sell it for $35K, oh yeah and dealers are not allowed to gouge. It would outsell the F150, and Mustang combined. But we know that is not going to happen either.

One other thing that everyone here is overlooking. I did make some mention earlier, but everyone prefers the hatchback, right? Well....lets say most. I am not one of those but it really doesn't matter. Ford has been taking a beating from the press on the Focus ST. So what makes the RS better in hatch configuration? More power? AWD? Better Seats? Granted, everyone who has bought a Focus ST, loves their car. And who wouldn't, its a cool car. But it has issues that cant be overlooked. So if you add more power, to car that cant keep its control under 265HP, does 315 and AWD make it better? I guess we will see and should the media decide under performance test that it works. I will be 4th in line to buy one because on paper, it is everything I would build in a car. I would really like to see what STIG had to say about it after driving it on Top Gear because he didn't like the Focus ST.

I am very serious.
 

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Look at what the press has done with the Ford Focus ST. They have basically put it under their boot and shrugged at it. Not one piece of Media has had anything nice to say about it.
I don't know what you've been reading, but go back and watch some of the traditional car review magazines' YouTube videos on the ST or re-read their articles. The ST twins are always highly rated! It beat out the GTI before the Mark VIII came out, it was ranked as one of the 10 best cars you could buy! Some even went as far to say it was nearly better than the Golf R!

As for the apples and oranges, I am not sure why everyone responding to this thread is struggling with the concepts presented. Ford is not going to release a car that crushes the Mustang.
The RS does not "crush" the Mustang! They are releasing the Mustang GT350, which will easily "crush" the RS. This is part of Ford's 12 new performance vehicle initiative. Hell, you may see a Fusion RS that will "crush" the Focus ST! The horror!

It's strange that you want an RS, yet you feel the need to tear it down or claim that Ford isn't going to do what they announced at the RS reveal.
 
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