[FORZDA 2]

Sorry I did not meant to offend anyone. The RS does not have brake-based torque vectoring. Just get over it.....

Dang axel, you have convinced yourself and refuse to hear/see anything that contradicts your perception. That's a characteristic of a true leftist.

Just so you know a bit about me; I'm an experienced autocrosser and drag racer with oh, about 50 years of experience myself. I've own the (2014)FiestaST, (2017)FocusRS, and (2018) Raptor vehicles of the current Ford Performance line. Also owned an older FWD Ford and autocrossed it for 17 years. I've lived in South Dakota and raced FWD on the ice of Stockade Lake as well. Quite fun! The brake-biased torque vectoring (traction control) works just fine on the FocusRS as it does on other Ford vehicles. It does NOT intervene as a hard pulsing like the ABS. It is a much more smoothly applied brake force. It does NOT stop wheelspin, it only slows it enough to keep the drive functioning and the car moving. It is VERY smooth compared to throttle-based traction control that will sometimes close the throttle abruptly. Mazda uses a very similar brake AND throttle based system to assist in turn-in and traction control. It's VERY smooth. Oh, I have owned a few Mazdas as well, currently on my ~3rd CX-9, the latest a 2019 GT.

PS, the quotes I posted earlier were from the 2017 FocusRS Owners Supplement here:
2017 Focus RS (CEW) RS, Canada/United States of America, HM5J 19A285 DA enUSA, Edition date: 201611, First Printing

Feel free to do your own research to dispute what the writing and my driving experience says. You should install temp sensors near the brake rotors, then go out on your wet driving spree and watch the front brake temps when you spin the inside front out of corners,. You will indeed see the brake temp on that spinning wheel increase rapidly.

Yeah I'm old and I know things...

2017 FORD FOCUS RS


Owner's Manual Supplement

Update: You can find the latest version online at this link. Go to the Driving Aids Section...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwifjZHHtO3uAhWbFVkFHQn2Di0QFjABegQIAxAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fordservicecontent.com%2FFord_Content%2Fvdirsnet%2FOwnerManual%2FHome%2FIndex%3FVariantid%3D6018%26languageCode%3DEN%26countryCode%3DUSA%26marketCode%3DUS%26bookcode%3DO38768%26VIN%3D%26userMarket%3DUSA&usg=AOvVaw2K_2YDbXJB7kU6gvN0n6nV

 

[axelr]

Dang axel, you have convinced yourself and refuse to hear/see anything that contradicts your perception. That's a characteristic of a true leftist.

Just so you know a bit about me; I'm an experienced autocrosser and drag racer with oh, about 50 years of experience myself. I've own the (2014)FiestaST, (2017)FocusRS, and (2018) Raptor vehicles of the current Ford Performance line. Also owned an older FWD Ford and autocrossed it for 17 years. I've lived in South Dakota and raced FWD on the ice of Stockade Lake as well. Quite fun! The brake-biased torque vectoring (traction control) works just fine on the FocusRS as it does on other Ford vehicles. It does NOT intervene as a hard pulsing like the ABS. It is a much more smoothly applied brake force. It does NOT stop wheelspin, it only slows it enough to keep the drive functioning and the car moving. It is VERY smooth compared to throttle-based traction control that will sometimes close the throttle abruptly. Mazda uses a very similar brake AND throttle based system to assist in turn-in and traction control. It's VERY smooth. Oh, I have owned a few Mazdas as well, currently on my ~3rd CX-9, the latest a 2019 GT.

PS, the quotes I posted earlier were from the 2017 FocusRS Owners Supplement here:
2017 Focus RS (CEW) RS, Canada/United States of America, HM5J 19A285 DA enUSA, Edition date: 201611, First Printing

Feel free to do your own research to dispute what the writing and my driving experience says. You should install temp sensors near the brake rotors, then go out on your wet driving spree and watch the front brake temps when you spin the inside front out of corners,. You will indeed see the brake temp on that spinning wheel increase rapidly.

Yeah I'm old and I know things...
View attachment 349524
2017 FORD FOCUS RS


Owner's Manual Supplement

Update: You can find the latest version online at this link. Go to the Driving Aids Section...

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwifjZHHtO3uAhWbFVkFHQn2Di0QFjABegQIAxAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.fordservicecontent.com%2FFord_Content%2Fvdirsnet%2FOwnerManual%2FHome%2FIndex%3FVariantid%3D6018%26languageCode%3DEN%26countryCode%3DUSA%26marketCode%3DUS%26bookcode%3DO38768%26VIN%3D%26userMarket%3DUSA&usg=AOvVaw2K_2YDbXJB7kU6gvN0n6nV

I don’t know what American politics have to do with this?

A link to the Ford website is one good step closer to this becoming believable: perhaps the RS has brake torque vectoring after all, so subtle it does not do anything?

Besides that, the paragraph on “enhanced torque vectoring control” comes verbatim from the ST’s manual. For the time being, I call this a documentation error.

I find it interesting the German Ford Vehicle Dynamics engineer (chef test driver) that developed the freaking car does not say a word about brake-based front torque vectoring when driving the car himself and demonstrating limit cornering? Maybe there is also an explanation for that? Did he forget?

I don’t engage in pissing contests. I’m glad to learn you have so much driving experience 😊

The brake pressure is broadcast on one of the CAN buses. I’ll see if I can find a way to log it, to spot those elusive silent and imperceptible inner-wheel brake actions.

 

[2002whitegt]

I'm buying spacers for my RS and looking for the 400mm at Tema 4x4 I can't find them, can you tell me where did you buy the 40mm spacers?

Thanks

Sorry for the late reply, the winter storm messed with our power the last few days down here in Houston.

They do not sell a complete 40mm kit. I wanted the rear to be lifted just a bit more and was able to purchase the rear spacers at 40mm separately

Amazon.com: Rear coil spacers 40mm for Ford FOCUS 3 2011-2019 | FUSION (USA) 2005-2012 | Lift Kit: Automotive

Buy Rear coil spacers 40mm for Ford FOCUS 3 2011-2019 | FUSION (USA) 2005-2012 | Lift Kit: Body & Suspension Lift Kits - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

Amazon.com: Rear shock extenders 40mm for Ford ESCAPE 2013-present | B-MAX 2012-present | C-MAX 2003-2018 | FOCUS 2 2004-2011 | FOCUS 3 2011-2016 | GRAND C-MAX 2010-2012 | KUGA 2008-2019 | Lift Kit: Automotive

Buy Rear shock extenders 40mm for Ford ESCAPE 2013-present | B-MAX 2012-present | C-MAX 2003-2018 | FOCUS 2 2004-2011 | FOCUS 3 2011-2016 | GRAND C-MAX 2010-2012 | KUGA 2008-2019 | Lift Kit: Shocks - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

I don't know if they make the front ones at 40mm, but I also haven't searched.

 

[SenderPiggins]

That's a characteristic of a true leftist.

Us Marxists catching strays every day in America.

@axelr
FWIW to this thread the original ad for the RS AWD system mentions brakes.

To deliver optimum driving dynamics, the Ford Performance All-Wheel-Drive system was calibrated alongside the car's advanced Electronic Stability Control, in particular the brake-based Torque Vectoring Control system that works in parallel with the torque-vectoring AWD.

Translation: The front differential is an open differential with brake-based torque vectoring.

 

[axelr]

Us Marxists catching strays every day in America.

@axelr
FWIW to this thread the original ad for the RS AWD system mentions brakes.

View attachment 349565

To deliver optimum driving dynamics, the Ford Performance All-Wheel-Drive system was calibrated alongside the car's advanced Electronic Stability Control, in particular the brake-based Torque Vectoring Control system that works in parallel with the torque-vectoring AWD.

Translation: The front differential is an open differential with brake-based torque vectoring.

I don’t question the marketing material. This all comes from the ST material, and from the RS announcements made in March 2015 when Ford also said the engine was producing 315hp.

What I question is if the system actually made it to the production car, and I think it did not.

All I got so far is multiple quotes pointing to the same material and no hint whatsoever the system is actually there.

Sending pressure to the brakes without depressing the brake pedal requires actions from pumps and solenoids which are not known for being silent when the do the exact same thing as part of ESP, ABS, AEB and whatever other driver assist involving the brakes, and also the electronic brake bleeding system. Invariably, the system can be heard and felt (the brake pedal shakes, thanks to Newton laws) and I never felt or heard any of that when cornering with lots of throttle and pesking about the ****ty diff they put at the front.

All I know is I never felt anything that remotely ressembles an effort from the car to make the open front diff behave in any other way than any open front diff, and that the engineer who developed the car did not mention any front torque vectoring when demonstrating the car himself (to Ken Block...) for the first time.

I also attended to the Ford Performance academy where the car’s torque vectoring and it’s effect on the car dynamics was described in details by Ford employees who happens to be professional racers and no one ever mentioned front brake-based vectoring.

 

[axelr]

Boys settle down. I won’t throw fuel on the fire but will happily show my worn rear pads. 😎😉
why did those wear out so fast. 🤪

That is a great question, but probably not with the help of any front brake-based torque vectoring 😇

 

[SenderPiggins]

To get this (slightly) back on track, has anyone else had long suspensions with springs that buckled?

With my Reigers, the springs buckled and rubbed like they were dragging its nails across a blackboard. Reiger's sent me new springs, which are slightly stiffer, and I'm concerned it might repeat because maybe there was something I did that caused the buckling in the first place.

I'm gonna install them when new wheels come, and I'm curious if there's anything I should do to help them not do that again.

 

[thirdgen89gta]

I don’t question the marketing material. This all comes from the ST material, and from the RS announcements made in March 2015 when Ford also said the engine was producing 315hp.

What I question is if the system actually made it to the production car, and I think it did not.

All I got so far is multiple quotes pointing to the same material and no hint whatsoever the system is actually there.

Sending pressure to the brakes without depressing the brake pedal requires actions from pumps and solenoids which are not known for being silent when the do the exact same thing as part of ESP, ABS, AEB and whatever other driver assist involving the brakes, and also the electronic brake bleeding system. Invariably, the system can be heard and felt (the brake pedal shakes, thanks to Newton laws) and I never felt or heard any of that when cornering with lots of throttle and pesking about the ****ty diff they put at the front.

All I know is I never felt anything that remotely ressembles an effort from the car to make the open front diff behave in any other way than any open front diff, and that the engineer who developed the car did not mention any front torque vectoring when demonstrating the car himself (to Ken Block...) for the first time.

I also attended to the Ford Performance academy where the car’s torque vectoring and it’s effect on the car dynamics was described in details by Ford employees who happens to be professional racers and no one ever mentioned front brake-based vectoring.

As someone who owned an ST and tracked it, I can tell you that 100% its very difficult to tell when the E-Diff algorithm is active. And no, I could not feel the torque vectoring mechanically, but I could observe its effects on the actual chassis line vs intended line from the steering wheel input.

The RS does have the EDiff, as well as the Torque Vectoring. However, due to just how WELL the RDU can steer the car with just the rear wheels, the system is used significantly less than than the eTVC.

Even the RDU can be subtle as hell. Just turn it off for a bit and watch how rapidly the chassis dynamics change. Even when you don't THINK the rdu is doming something it is. And its the same with the E-Diff and eTVC. Very subtle.

 

[Engage]

Only one person on here has done the RDC kit (@gmoneyjive) but he hasn’t posted here for some time now. I assume lots of the kit is based on base-model focus parts (springs, shock length, LCA etc). I didn’t go that route but I assume it’s a pretty solid setup.

for all we know the RDC kit could be based on Ford Escape parts ¯\(ツ)/¯

I sure wish they would have left some feedback/pictures on it. A third party with first hand experience of the kit would be awesome. RDC does have some videos up but I would like to see how it sits better and and know how much more tire I can add. As it stands my new to me 18 is box stock and a substantial lift like the Crosstrek clan does is what I would like.