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So my cousins car had the head gasket failure, and they determined the head was off by 6/1000s of an inch. What is this is the root cause, and not the gasket itself?
0.006” is a large variation on a head surface, depending on the angle and location of the deviation. As discussed in this thread, the likely root cause is the head surface itself and the gasket revisions are the first round of fixes to try out. Many will scoff at Ford, but there is/was a viable possibility the newest gasket could fix the problem. The main issue is whether the head surface deviation(s) is consistent in location or size. or random. If random sizes and locations are the norm, then nothing but a resurfaced or new head will fix it.
 

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0.006” is a large variation on a head surface, depending on the angle and location of the deviation. As discussed in this thread, the likely root cause is the head surface itself and the gasket revisions are the first round of fixes to try out. Many will scoff at Ford, but there is/was a viable possibility the newest gasket could fix the problem. The main issue is whether the head surface deviation(s) is consistent in location or size. or random. If random sizes and locations are the norm, then nothing but a resurfaced or new head will fix it.
Doubtful that, anymore than the constant claim that this failure is so rare as to be considered insignificant is this theory that the head is any causal part of the problem, other than what the differential expansion rates of dissimilar metals that then exacerbates the open deck design chosen for the RSs 2.3 turboed engine.
What I have is a more researched and developing theory, and consequently, the possibly scary thought, we are all screwed until we replace the block with a 2.0 version, that could be safely run stock or tuned. Can only hope a new "improved" 5th version head gasket will solve it but doubt that too.

A quick resource read?

"The downside to an open deck is that it*provides the least amount of structural support at*the top of the cylinder walls, where they need it most. This reason alone makes*an open deck*block the least reliable*choice for almost any type of forced induction or nitrous application, and should be left to low compression, naturally aspirated engines and low boost platforms." from Supporting Your Cylinders - Open, Semi-Closed, Or Closed Deck?

A final observation on why some failures might occur at a relativly low mileage and others at a much higher mileage.

If thermal expansion is a significant factor, them how many times an engine is used {allowed to reach operating temperature, then cooled off} over a given period of time would be a failure factor. {Ford could check key cycles?.}

My "short" trips are 100+ miles and many were 300 +(long vacation trips} between engine heat cycles.

Perhaps why I made the 29,000 mile club before exhaust smoking?

Short trippers beware?
 

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So....




I just completed video scoping my 2017 RS. Everything has been running spectacular and no coolant loss. The scopes paint an ugly picture with clear gasket damage and erosion occurring between cylinders 1 and 2. 2-3 and 3-4 are fine. All other contact surface seen appears in great shape.

The advantage with mine is high mileage, now over 9k in only 4 months where most 2017s do not have these much on the odometer. My build date is March 2017.

I'll post up the pictures later when I can in a separate post. Not sure why the pictures Alex posted of their RS project car had so much carbon build, mine is quite clean. It was hard at least for me to see the gasket clearly in those pics posted.

Weighing several options at this point centered around legal action with investigative engineering which means I'll be without my RS for sometime. This has gone on long enough and unlike some less fortunate owners I do have the resources and connections to be a serious pain in the ass to Ford. But then again Ford can and may very well put all this behind us if they just do what's right and make no mistake, Ford knows what has to done for a permanent fix. I would like to spend my free time and money on more enjoyable endeavors then chasing Ford down to come clean on this.

Please do not PM me, once this starts up it will be handled by another party as this process evolves for others to get involved if they choose. I will no longer be able to communicate personally at that point either on anything related to this. It will take several months getting to a public point of action (as in late Spring 2018).

I'll post the pics/vids later. Going to spend some of my Saturday doing more enjoyable activities.....
 

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So....




I just completed video scoping my 2017 RS. Everything has been running spectacular and no coolant loss. The scopes paint an ugly picture with clear gasket damage and erosion occurring between cylinders 1 and 2. 2-3 and 3-4 are fine. All other contact surface seen appears in great shape.

The advantage with mine is high mileage, now over 9k in only 4 months where most 2017s do not have these much on the odometer. My build date is March 2017.

I'll post up the pictures later when I can in a separate post. Not sure why the pictures Alex posted of their RS project car had so much carbon build, mine is quite clean. It was hard at least for me to see the gasket clearly in those pics posted.

Weighing several options at this point centered around legal action with investigative engineering which means I'll be without my RS for sometime. This has gone on long enough and unlike some less fortunate owners I do have the resources and connections to be a serious pain in the ass to Ford. But then again Ford can and may very well put all this behind us if they just do what's right and make no mistake, Ford knows what has to done for a permanent fix. I would like to spend my free time and money on more enjoyable endeavors then chasing Ford down to come clean on this.

Please do not PM me, once this starts up it will be handled by another party as this process evolves for others to get involved if they choose. I will no longer be able to communicate personally at that point either on anything related to this. It will take several months getting to a public point of action (as in late Spring 2018).

I'll post the pics/vids later. Going to spend some of my Saturday doing more enjoyable activities.....
Really appreciate you passing this information along. Very interesting.
 

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If you’re (hopefully) not bs’ing, thank you and good luck. You know we got your back man.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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If you?re (hopefully) not bs?ing, thank you and good luck. You know we got your back man.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Here is a little preview attached. I'll post what I used, where to get, etc. so others may do the same (later).

The left shows what most of the gasket/sealing looks like. The right is where you get into the round between cylinders...this location of wear (scrubbing) is in the same location Alex has posted in his technical blog/post.

I have a lot of pics/vid to post which give more to see then this. Including the good surfaces (majority of contact area is beautiful).

It helps a lot if your combustion camber is somewhat clean. Maybe run 2-3 tanks through with PEA before scoping yourselves. Use Chevron brand complete fuel system (I am not affiliated with Chevron.... actually a competitor). I use my own proprietary formula/mix (long time research chemist who has previously worked in this area...that's my gig).
 

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This is the exact crap that does nothing to further the thread, so glad you're back. I don't have a figure that says there are 200 worldwide. I I have a list with 150 people have posted on various forums.

I would never claim to extrapolate the total failures worldwide from me looking at posts on 4 forums. Just like you shouldn't extrapolate how many cars have been made by using your VIN and build date.

Moreover, how many of those are sitting at dealerships? Thousands here in the US. Thousands and thousands more have very low milage still.

But sure, someone else come in this thread and throw some more random guess failure rates out there first and then figure out a way to make numbers you have made up fill in the math to fit your narrative.

I don't even know why you have a narrative man, I know you said you used to work for Ford, I guess you're just loyal to the brand/company. That's fine, I love this car as well, I just don't love you making up numbers over and over, trying to temper the flames when it's beyond obvious that this is a major issue for many of your fellow FocusRS.org members RE: this topic/thread.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
Conversely, I do not enjoy you stirring up Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt in this thread. To each his own, I guess.
 

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Conversely, I do not enjoy you stirring up Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt in this thread. To each his own, I guess.
The fact that you're acting like you have no clue of knowing what thread we're in [Failed/Leaking Head Gasket Resource Thread] simply means you either, work with lucky phil in the Ford PR dept. or don't own an RS, or are trying to sell an RS and trying to minimize this issue, or fearfully waiting for your RS to need an engine.

The pot is boiling already, stirring it is obviously necessary to get through the thick skull of Ford and/or those deniers here.

Thanks for your helpful non-illuminating post. It has added greatly to how to handle this situation that many actual RS owners are already swimming in!
Don't need the information posted here? Then don't read it.

You're not our middle school principal. Corporations never learn that the cover up is worse than the crime.
 

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This is the exact crap that does nothing to further the thread, so glad you're back. I don't have a figure that says there are 200 worldwide. I I have a list with 150 people have posted on various forums.

I would never claim to extrapolate the total failures worldwide from me looking at posts on 4 forums. Just like you shouldn't extrapolate how many cars have been made by using your VIN and build date.

Moreover, how many of those are sitting at dealerships? Thousands here in the US. Thousands and thousands more have very low milage still.

But sure, someone else come in this thread and throw some more random guess failure rates out there first and then figure out a way to make numbers you have made up fill in the math to fit your narrative.

I don't even know why you have a narrative man, I know you said you used to work for Ford, I guess you're just loyal to the brand/company. That's fine, I love this car as well, I just don't love you making up numbers over and over, trying to temper the flames when it's beyond obvious that this is a major issue for many of your fellow FocusRS.org members RE: this topic/thread.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
I have never worked for Ford, have never claimed to. I'm just presenting the information that we actually have and or can senseably extrapolate. Others can interpret how they see fit, optimistically, pessimistically, rationally or irrationally. It's their choice.

Ciao
 

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Here is a little preview attached. I'll post what I used, where to get, etc. so others may do the same (later).

The left shows what most of the gasket/sealing looks like. The right is where you get into the round between cylinders...this location of wear (scrubbing) is in the same location Alex has posted in his technical blog/post.

I have a lot of pics/vid to post which give more to see then this. Including the good surfaces (majority of contact area is beautiful).

It helps a lot if your combustion camber is somewhat clean. Maybe run 2-3 tanks through with PEA before scoping yourselves. Use Chevron brand complete fuel system (I am not affiliated with Chevron.... actually a competitor). I use my own proprietary formula/mix (long time research chemist who has previously worked in this area...that's my gig).
Great image Reg. Much easier to see the detail. Is that top blue layer the Viton polymer that’s eroding?
 

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You seem to have become emotional and unhinged.
Accusing those who dont share the same view of working for Ford PR - really??

"For those who understand, no explanation is needed. For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible"

and a seemingly little known fact. A failed/failing head gasket can actually leak coolant into the combustion chambers and/or an oil drain passage that leads to the oil pan. Guess what it then does there? Can't wait for when cars are all electric and the posters start asking for a tune! Good grief!
 

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I have never worked for Ford, have never claimed to. I'm just presenting the information that we actually have and or can senseably extrapolate. Others can interpret how they see fit, optimistically, pessimistically, rationally or irrationally. It's their choice.

Ciao
I'm sorry it was a conversation you were having with PiSigma earlier in this thread and he said he did and I had it backwards in my mind, my mistake.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

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Conversely, I do not enjoy you stirring up Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt in this thread. To each his own, I guess.
The fact that you're acting like you have no clue of knowing what thread we're in [Failed/Leaking Head Gasket Resource Thread] simply means you either, work with lucky phil in the Ford PR dept. or don't own an RS, or are trying to sell an RS and trying to minimize this issue, or fearfully waiting for your RS to need an engine.

The pot is boiling already, stirring it is obviously necessary to get through the thick skull of Ford and/or those deniers here.

Thanks for your helpful non-illuminating post. It has added greatly to how to handle this situation that many actual RS owners are already swimming in!
Don't need the information posted here? Then don't read it.

You're not our middle school principal. Corporations never learn that the cover up is worse than the crime.
Dude, your first paragraph here is projecting all your own fears onto others who dont share your point of view. Keep the discussion rationale and free of emotion.

I dont think anyone is doubting there is a problem, no one really knows the full magnitude - it is still evolving. You seem to think other members are conspiring with Ford when they express a different view?

Lucky Phil must be the worst shill ever. Your not supposed to criticise your own components or processes when shilling dude........

Sympathies for all who are suffering currently. Hopefully all affected cars get fixed by Ford - which seems to be happening, although not in a timely or acceptable manner
 

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