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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
As a disclaimer, Ford could be inhibiting the cars performance for the first XXXX amount of miles to help the engine break in, which would be completely understandable, but that's something they need to tell their customers if they are actually doing that.

On Friday, my car went 13.9 at the track using the factory launch control and cutting a 1.9 sixty foot. The sixty foot could be a little better on street tires, but a 1.9 is decent for the first time out getting used to the car and experimenting with potential launching techniques outside of the factory launch control. The 99mph is what is really disconcerting, that indicates how far down on power the car was. This car with its weight and 350hp should trap with around another 10mph, even if my mother was launching it.

The second time down the track I noticed my car was only making 17 or 18 psi in all gears including 3rd and 4th. I couldn't video it with my phone and forgot my GoPro headrest mount, but I was able to have a passenger video it after I left the track and it was still doing the same thing on the highway. When I would row through the gears, at other times when I would stab it in a single gear the car would see 22 or 23psi on the factory gauge. Below is a 3rd or 4th gear pull on the highway and a pull on my dyno, the fluctuations (at least on the factory gauge) are pretty wild, once I install my other gauges I will verify whether that is the gauge or the system.

Focus RS poor boost levels:

Focus RS boost fluctuations:


Before "that guy" starts whining about reaction times, I was there to get used to the launch control and test that as well as race the clock, not the person in the right lane.




Because of this, I decided to dyno it. The car was dynoed in 2wd mode because I haven't purchased a 4wd Dynojet yet. Before "that guy" comes in talking about hero numbers, that wasn't at all the purpose, these were diagnostic numbers. I'll write something up on how to do that later when I have more time. The highest run the car made was 305whp and the lowest was 257whp and these 2 runs were within a few minutes of each other. That was the truly disheartening thing to see, I believe Kaizen saw a similar inconsistency. There is no reason a car should have a 48whp swing like that unless it is intentional, be certain it was not heat soak as this isn't my first rodeo. Boost was all over the place on the factory gauge in some of the runs and in the lower power run below, boost was exactly like it was at the track, 17 or 18 peak psi which would correlate with the awful mph.



After that I started playing with manual control of boost to get some consistency. I believe Ford is manipulating boost control near redline as well, I believe it bleeds pressure off when you shift with the variable cam, but that's speculation and I won't know until I can log. They are also manipulating timing to control power as well and I think that is why the car would make +/- 20whp after I got boost consistent with a manual controller. I'm hoping this is related to some sort of engine break in nonsense and not poor design or overly sensitive knock sensors, but it's speculation until I can log and get more mileage on the car. The car has 93 octane in it. I may try a higher octane to see if the runs become consistent from that.

FYI the car goes into limp mode when you overboost it even by a pound or two of pressure. The car has to be shut off and then turned back on to eliminate this. The annoying thing about that is Ford won't allow you shut the car off if you are doing over 5mph (although I have not tried a long press of the button, I think that'd be a happy medium for safety) so you have to completely stop the car. Hopefully Cobb eliminates this completely or allows you a long press to cycle the car while you are rolling down the road and might want to cycle the key for various circumstances such as triggering limp mode.

Anyway, hopefully this is temporary or an anomaly, if not I'll be selling mine and getting another GTR for a beater.



[edit 6-30-16]

The car finally made repeatable power. Idkwtf is different but I made 4 runs in a row tonight, in a span of 5 minutes. The car was already warmed up and at NOT for coolant and oil temperature. I had a fan on the engine and a fan on the intercooler as always and the car didn't sweat.

The car had slight erratic boost, but nothing like it did before and it was holding boost until redline. The car has ~535 miles on it now.

Below are the 3rd gear runs, run number 32 (4th gear) not pictured made 301whp and I forget the torque.




Focus RS dyno 6-30-16:
 

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Good post and detail. Hopefully it gets figured out. Ever since Kaizen's post it was obvious it wasn't a matter of overboost but instead something else going on, possibly extremely protective ECU tuning from Ford...
 

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Very interesting finds. Though, I'm not quite sure what you're saying warrants selling the RS if it all can be tuned out.
 

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Ummm........sir......EVERY car i've ever driven with "Push To Start" will not let you simply PRESS the button to turn it off while moving. You have to HOLD the button and it turns off every time.

Problem #1 solved.....now you other guys can figure out the rest! lol
 

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What if you were able to tune it so the over boost function is constant. I don't know why they would have an over boost function that's accessible for 15-20 seconds and can be reset by a lift of the gas. I could understand a selectable over boost function. I have heard of some tuners utilize the cruise control on/off button to select tunes (while cruise is on the tune is off, vice versa) I would say tune out low boost function and that would likely fix these problems, but then again I really don't know much about tuning.
 

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assuming its not something like a loose charge pipe or a weak wastegate, it sounds like it must be tuning related as some mentioned. I do feel its something that can be easily fixed, so until we reach a mechanical limitation, I will remain in the not worried camp. not worried, yet.
 

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its not heatsoak but the 170* charge temps aren't helping
 

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What if you were able to tune it so the over boost function is constant. I don't know why they would have an over boost function that's accessible for 15-20 seconds and can be reset by a lift of the gas. I could understand a selectable over boost function. I have heard of some tuners utilize the cruise control on/off button to select tunes (while cruise is on the tune is off, vice versa) I would say tune out low boost function and that would likely fix these problems, but then again I really don't know much about tuning.
Overboost isn't causing a peak WHP difference. The boost bleeds off at higher RPM regardless of whether was used or not earlier in the RPM band. Turbo is too small to keep up that level of boost at higher RPMs.
 

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Stock tune and early modification teething problems.
Once total control of the ECU and good mapping is realized, I'd expect a full exhaust + custom tuned car to make 350whp Dynojet with ease on 93 octane.
 

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Good post. Hopefully some light will shine on this subject soon enough with more cars being sent out into the wild.

What/where is GTE enterprises?
 

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Stock tune and early modification teething problems.
Once total control of the ECU and good mapping is realized, I'd expect a full exhaust + custom tuned car to make 350whp Dynojet with ease on 93 octane.
What?

This issue being discussed is how terribly inconsistent the car is stock. a ~50whp variance is insane. No one is talking about modifications in this thread.
 

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This probably has a lot to do with the ECU learning and adjusting constantly. COBB will get an AP out soon enough to establish better, and more consistent, boost parameters.

Source: COBB Tuning ? Ford Ecoboost and the Octane Adjust Ratio Monitor

BY KYLE ON 06/03/2015
FORD ECOBOOST AND THE OCTANE ADJUST RATIO MONITOR


All Ford Ecoboosts use a dynamic multiplier known as Octane Adjust Ratio. This parameter can be monitored with the Accessport and is helpful in ensuring the fuel in your tank is adequate. It is especially important on an Ecoboost vehicle when peak power is expected (dyno tuning, racing) to make sure the parameter is at the optimal -1.0 value.

STRATEGY BACKGROUND

This vehicle is equipped with several dynamic load, airflow, and torque targeting and limiting strategies. These strategies allow the vehicle to achieve consistent performance with varying atmospheric conditions and fuel quality. There are no set “boost targets” with these strategies, and as such boost pressure can vary depending on driving conditions.
HOW IT ALL WORKS

From the factory, Ford typically designs the base calibration to allow use of 87+ octane fuel and recommends using 91+ octane fuel for optimal power. They can do this by means of a dynamic multiplier that allows for adjustment of each of these targeting and limiting strategies which we call the “OAR” (Octane Adjust Ratio). The OAR starts life at a value of 0.0 and is allowed to learn in two directions. When fuel quality and knock sensor feedback are optimal, the OAR will adjust towards -1.0. When these are sub-optimal, the OAR will adjust towards +1.0. I bet you’re wondering why -1.0 is better?
Well for one, since this value is a multiplier and not an offset the ECU code can be optimized to use a single table comprised of negative values to handle the spectrum of operating conditions. Take ignition timing corrections for example; with an OAR at -1.0, multiplying against a negative becomes positive which is then added as positive correction to ignition timing. However, when conditions are sub-par a +1.0 OAR will result in negative correction to ignition timing.
HOW DOES IT EFFECT POWER?

Additionally, the OAR is used in other strategies such as LSPI (Low Speed Preignition), and part-throttle combustion stability. These are functions designed to dynamically limit load production in the event that fuel quality is not optimal. We want the ECU to limit load as it will remove stress and prevent damage automatically. The part-throttle limiter allows for casual driving at moderate loads while maintaining stoichiometric operation. This allows for increases in fuel mileage but at the expense of heat. Heat is generated much more quickly with lower octane fuels and can cause detonation. This is why it is necessary for the OAR to step in and allow for adjustment. In the case of LSPI, the OAR is used to create a blending ratio between three separate load limits to mitigate the possibility of preignition.
HOW DOES COBB USE OAR?

Our calibrations attempt to utilize as many of the OEM strategies as possible to offer the most advanced, powerful, and safest driving experience to you. Most of our calibrations utilize the OAR just as the factory does. However, our calibrations are designed for a specific octane rating and have a no nonsense policy for knock. If the ECU senses knock, we will aggressively adjust the OAR towards positive. We have designed the OAR to be utilized so that maximum performance is achieved for the specified octane. This is why it is important to run the appropriate calibration for your available fuel type! The OAR is also a KAM (keep alive memory) stored value and will be reset upon initial installation of the Accessport. It will take time to learn, so don’t be alarmed after a few days of driving if it’s not fully settled. Once learned, the value will persist through each start-up (even through “change map”). The value may change from time to time based on knock sensor feedback, which is completely normal and expected. If you find the OAR value does not stay near -1.0 when using top tier fuels, please use the Accessport to change to a lower octane calibration until better fuel can be found.
 

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What?

This issue being discussed is how terribly inconsistent the car is stock. a ~50whp variance is insane. No one is talking about modifications in this thread.
The stock tune is clearly crap for repeatability, as verified by multiple dyno runs, magazine trap speeds that don't correlate to 350 crank HP, and now an independent dragstrip trap below 100mph.

Overboost not engaging is only one of few variables that can account for a swing that wide. Extreme knock in high heat and poor fuel would be another.

Yes, it's erratic and disappointing stock, but there is a ton of power left on the table.

And the OP in fact is discussing modifications, as he's already added a manual boost controller in attempt to decrease the boost drop on the subsequent runs. Others are mentioning the Cobb AP. The limp mode from the MBC is likely from partial throttle boost inconsistencies based on parameters the ECU is looking for not matching up, so I'm not off topic. Lighten up a little.
 

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My stock ST ran equal to that with a 2.1 60ft time, bone stock. The RS in question might be down 80-90hp


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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As a disclaimer, Ford could be inhibiting the cars performance for the first XXXX amount of miles to help the engine break in, which would be completely understandable, but that's something they need to tell their customers if they are actually doing that.

On Friday, my car went 13.9 at the track using the factory launch control and cutting a 1.9 sixty foot. The sixty foot could be a little better on street tires, but a 1.9 is decent for the first time out getting used to the car and experimenting with potential launching techniques outside of the factory launch control. The 99mph is what is really disconcerting, that indicates how far down on power the car was. This car with its weight and 350hp should trap with around another 10mph, even if my mother was launching it.

The second time down the track I noticed my car was only making 17 or 18 psi in all gears including 3rd and 4th. I couldn't video it with my phone and forgot my GoPro headrest mount, but I was able to have a passenger video it after I left the track and it was still doing the same thing on the highway. When I would row through the gears, at other times when I would stab it in a single gear the car would see 22 or 23psi on the factory gauge. Below is a 3rd or 4th gear pull on the highway and a pull on my dyno, the fluctuations (at least on the factory gauge) are pretty wild, once I install my other gauges I will verify whether that is the gauge or the system.

Focus RS poor boost levels:

Focus RS boost fluctuations:


Before "that guy" starts whining about reaction times, I was there to get used to the launch control and test that as well as race the clock, not the person in the right lane.




Because of this, I decided to dyno it. The car was dynoed in 2wd mode because I haven't purchased a 4wd Dynojet yet. Before "that guy" comes in talking about hero numbers, that wasn't at all the purpose, these were diagnostic numbers. I'll write something up on how to do that later when I have more time. The highest run the car made was 305whp and the lowest was 257whp and these 2 runs were within a few minutes of each other. That was the truly disheartening thing to see, I believe Kaizen saw a similar inconsistency. There is no reason a car should have a 48whp swing like that unless it is intentional, be certain it was not heat soak as this isn't my first rodeo. Boost was all over the place on the factory gauge in some of the runs and in the lower power run below, boost was exactly like it was at the track, 17 or 18 peak psi which would correlate with the awful mph.



After that I started playing with manual control of boost to get some consistency. I believe Ford is manipulating boost control near redline as well, I believe it bleeds pressure off when you shift with the variable cam, but that's speculation and I won't know until I can log. They are also manipulating timing to control power as well and I think that is why the car would make +/- 20whp after I got boost consistent with a manual controller. I'm hoping this is related to some sort of engine break in nonsense and not poor design or overly sensitive knock sensors, but it's speculation until I can log and get more mileage on the car. The car has 93 octane in it. I may try a higher octane to see if the runs become consistent from that.

FYI the car goes into limp mode when you overboost it even by a pound or two of pressure. The car has to be shut off and then turned back on to eliminate this. The annoying thing about that is Ford won't allow you shut the car off if you are doing over 5mph (although I have not tried a long press of the button, I think that'd be a happy medium for safety) so you have to completely stop the car. Hopefully Cobb eliminates this completely or allows you a long press to cycle the car while you are rolling down the road and might want to cycle the key for various circumstances such as triggering limp mode.

Anyway, hopefully this is temporary or an anomaly, if not I'll be selling mine and getting another GTR for a beater.
My factory gauge has never hit the third line on the stock gauge. I have an autometer analog gauge referenced from the line off the compressor side before the solenoid as well and the needle shakes so much under full boost its hard to get an accurate read and i havent found any boost leaks
 

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20140228_192731-01.jpg heatsoak is so bad on the ST and the mustang, that an intercooler is a must have first or second mod
 

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The OP already said it's not heat soak. I don't know what data he has backing that up but I'm inclined to believe him.
that's fine, I'm not going to forget what I already know. consistent charge temps make consistent power. must be something wrong with the o.p. car. I think if this car was tuned it may have popped during these runs, i'd really like to see how early the timing hit its low limit on the last run cuz after all keeping it pinned down while all cylinder are at-6 is not good practice
 
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