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^This^ I mean, I'm not saying LSPI is made up, but if it was that huge of concern, wouldn't we be seeing all GDI engines grenading themselves prematurely? Or at least a good portion of them. In the video linked above, keep in mind who's giving the information. It's a sales guy. A really good sales guy at that. The southern accent really helps in sounding genuine. And being in sales myself, I can tell you the job of a sales guy is to make you believe you want (NEED) what I'm selling. With all research findings, you always have to look at who conducted the study and who is doling out the info. Like I said, I'm sure this is a real problem. But it seems this can be exacerbated by bad driving habits. You shouldn't be lugging the engine on ANY car. With 28k miles on my RS, running a tune for almost 18k of those, using Motorcraft 5W-50, I would think I would be seeing knock all over the place, which I don't. There are others that have mileage way beyond mine in the mileage thread. I mean, heck, @RedBaron80 just said he hit 109K a couple days ago. I would never imagine this engine holding out for that long. So I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, with my four 12-packs of Motorcraft 5W-50 I have in my garage (that I scored on a ridiculous deal posted on here a while ago). Shout out to @bbq_pork !!!
It some cases one LSPI event will destroy an engine. For normal knock, the engine will pull timing to eliminate the knock when detected. The Ecoboost ECU is pretty good at pulling timing quickly to save the engine in these cases. Most tuners will also not tune your car to the ragged edge of what's safe. The risk for LSPI happening increase on a small displacement GDI turbo engine in low RPM, high-load situations when using certain motor oils.

The causes for each LSPI event aren't super well understood but fortunately they are relatively infrequent, but when they do happen they're pretty catastrophic. Research has shown that certain oil additive packages and driving conditions (described above) will increase the chances of LSPI. Using an API SN+ oil will help reduce the chances of LSPI if you're super concerned, but I don't think you can get the Ford Motorcraft 5w-50 oil with the SN+ certification yet.
 

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From what I understand, if you run E20-E90...you need to change your oil more often.
Pump gas change your oil every 7500 miles.
With E85 you need to change your oil every 3000 miles?....I would.
 
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You can never go wrong with high quality fuel, high quality oil and regular changes.
I also hear you guys have some Chevron product that can help with injectors.
In the appropriate doses it might not hurt your engine.
 

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Ooof bummer OP... this thought is always in the back of my head, specially now since we pretty much have the same mileage, model year and paid off.

Whats the exact assessment on the engine? Windowed the block? Siezed? Etc. Maybe some of it is salvageable and just need to be rebuilt?

As much of a pain it is, I wouldnt sell the car as-is. I would take off the after market parts and sell them individually, then sell the remaining car to a wrecker. From my experience, you will always have a better return doing it that way. Or, if you really love the platform, save the parts and try to find a used RS to transfer it to.

I really feel for ya man. It's a really tough situation, specially in these times. I've spent $$$ building and rebuilding a totalled project car because I love it so much. Doesn't make financial sense, but it does for mental health lol.
Mental health is priceless 🤘🏻
 

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My 2 cents, buy a used motor and have it installed. It’s not that huge of a job and the seller of the motor (if local) should stand behind the condition. Put proper oil like amsoil or other 2plus 5w50 in it. You said love the car, don’t tear the whole thing apart then trash it! Cars blow motors and every other part in and around it, replace broken parts and move on 😉
 

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Well, that's really bad. Keep your head up. If it's the API SN only oil issue, I guess go with an SN+. I called RedlIne and they said their oil additives don't cause LSPI and I've used it in my 2.3ltr Mazdaspeed3 for years.

Go with an Adam Tuned or SP63 2.0 ltr build. They should be very bullet proof. Of course over 450hp you'll need other parts like clutch and axles etc so watch all that **** too. Let us know how it goes.
 

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...What motor oil did you use?
The oil that blew two engines before I realized wtf was going on is the T6 Shell Rotella. It’s a diesel oil, but there were many people who had oil analysis done regularly and it performed great. Right up until it results in a single LSPI event that windows the block and blows parts out all over the place.

The key event for both engines was a short WOT pull followed by a short shift at ~5k, followed by another hard pull in the next gear. At the next gear change, all is good until I just step back on the throttle. As soon as fuel was sprayed, it exploded in #3 and within 2 seconds it was all over and locked up. I coasted with clutch in until I could get off the road, leaving a huge trail of oil in the road. I had thousands of miles on the tune with no knock problems. I WAS pushing the stock turbo pretty good, but had many WOT racing miles on it.

The critical issue for LSPI is running under relatively high load, then lifting throttle abruptly so the engine is still spinning at relatively high rpms with throttle closed. The relatively high and long vacuum pulls oil into the cylinder around the perimeter of the piston which is normal, but the DI engine leaves a lot of fuel around the perimeter where it mixes with the oil to form an extremely volatile compound. When raw fuel is sprayed into the super hot compound BOOM the entire mixture explodes.
It was this type of driving that blew both engines. The first one back in 2011 was actually running data logs and the second I was just driving on my favorite back road and lazily just wanted the “feel the pull” but not a full on WOT run to redline.
The moral of the story is:
1. Don’t use diesel oils because they have tons more detergents due to diesel soot problems. DI has similar issues, but calcium detergents are deadly.
2. If you’re going to poke a turbo DI engine, go all the way and stay WOT or only poke it ONCE and let it come back off boost and low rpms.
 
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I mean, you check the manual, you got the relevant selection criteria and you pick your poison.
I understand the need for more exotic substances but an oil that has no connection to the specifications & approvals stated by the manufacturer boggles the mind.
I had a look at the product specification page and I assume your choice was the 0w-40.
I am super confused as to why you'd use a SPECIFIC DIESEL OIL in your RS.

I am a rebel myself but when it comes to certain things I stick to what my manufacturer recommends.
I have done far more aggressive pulls than you state and all is in order.
I change my oil between 3000 miles and 4000 miles.
This is twice a year and I swap between Ow-40 and 5w-50 Supercar GT. Both from Castrol both made in collaboration with Ford for EcoBoost engines.
I apply a simple principle: If summer, use 5W-50 and track without the big risk of shear, else Ow-40.
I also pay a bit extra at the pump for the highest octane petrol available.

A few euros extra per tank can go along way to avoid potential LSPI.
I also check my injectors once a year.
Keeping this car healthy for savage accelerations costs money.
 

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I mean, you check the manual, you got the relevant selection criteria and you pick your poison.
I understand the need for more exotic substances but an oil that has no connection to the specifications & approvals stated by the manufacturer boggles the mind.
I had a look at the product specification page and I assume your choice was the 0w-40.
I am super confused as to why you'd use a SPECIFIC DIESEL OIL in your RS.

I am a rebel myself but when it comes to certain things I stick to what my manufacturer recommends.
I have done far more aggressive pulls than you state and all is in order.
I change my oil between 3000 miles and 4000 miles.
This is twice a year and I swap between Ow-40 and 5w-50 Supercar GT. Both from Castrol both made in collaboration with Ford for EcoBoost engines.
I apply a simple principle: If summer, use 5W-50 and track without the big risk of shear, else Ow-40.
I also pay a bit extra at the pump for the highest octane petrol available.

A few euros extra per tank can go along way to avoid potential LSPI.
I also check my injectors once a year.
Keeping this car healthy for savage accelerations costs money.
Diesel oil has been a great way to protect most engines when modifying way beyond the OE spec, specifically because of the additive package (particularly zinc on pushrod motors with tappet cams). Take a late 1970s large displacement V8 smogger motor, bump up the compression, add a cam, why not some cylinder heads, and you're way beyond of what is recommended by the manufacturer. You can easily double the HP in these motors without trying too hard. Rotella oil is probably the best oil to use in these types of motors, and many others that are heavily modified.

Turbo DI motors are a completely different animal because of LSPI. Those additives cut down on wear, but they also grenade an engine due to LSPI. It's only been the last handful of years where the additive package of oils has been found to been a major contributor to LSPI, hence the recent SN+ standard for turbo DI motors. Now we know, but I can't remember if this was common knowledge in 2016 but I'm guessing more no than yes.
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
Sorry for the late reply. Have been busy at taking care of other things.

Current update:
Going to buy a 2nd motor from a wreck RS that has 30k miles on it. That engine does not come with turbo, Hopefully i didnt damage my old turbo.
Planning to put that motor in my car and then just stay low and re-tune it. Hopefully nothing will go wrong again
 

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Diesel oil has been a great way to protect most engines when modifying way beyond the OE spec, specifically because of the additive package (particularly zinc on pushrod motors with tappet cams). Take a late 1970s large displacement V8 smogger motor, bump up the compression, add a cam, why not some cylinder heads, and you're way beyond of what is recommended by the manufacturer. You can easily double the HP in these motors without trying too hard. Rotella oil is probably the best oil to use in these types of motors, and many others that are heavily modified.

Turbo DI motors are a completely different animal because of LSPI. Those additives cut down on wear, but they also grenade an engine due to LSPI. It's only been the last handful of years where the additive package of oils has been found to been a major contributor to LSPI, hence the recent SN+ standard for turbo DI motors. Now we know, but I can't remember if this was common knowledge in 2016 but I'm guessing more no than yes.

I understand the desire to have a clean engine and follow specific guidelines.
Nowadays, with regular oil changes, extra money at the pump for better fuel and injector cleaning you decrease the LSPI to a point where it will not happen.
The SN+ is nice to have as well.

I am not familiar with Rotella and take your word for it.
I also had the opportunity to order a custom oil for my engine by this company Leistung durch Leidenschaft- seit 25 Jahren!
They are the best at what they do and it is advised to have it in a custom built / race engine.

With the potential problems associated with this vehicle, I stick to what the stickers recommend.
Having the wrong oil in your car will instantly kick out of a dealership for any warranty work.
 

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This AMSOIL product apparently is compatible with SN plus and WSS-M2C931-C (but Mustang only?)


I don't think that they do the certification process though. There is likely better stuff out there than the Motorcraft stuff, but I'll be using that until Ford recommends/designates an approved SN plus oil for the 2.3L Ecoboost. That way I'll have a fighting chance when trying to get warranty work done if that time comes.
 

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This AMSOIL product apparently is compatible with SN plus and WSS-M2C931-C (but Mustang only?)


I don't think that they do the certification process though. There is likely better stuff out there than the Motorcraft stuff, but I'll be using that until Ford recommends/designates an approved SN plus oil for the 2.3L Ecoboost. That way I'll have a fighting chance when trying to get warranty work done if that time comes.
I don't think that is a problem.
This is my oil and works for all engines with the relevant specification.
My dealer confirmed that warranty still applies.
 

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Rotella!

Man, they are big in Asia... made by Shell.

Blast from the past for me.

👍
 

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Just a quick point, if you're running an aftermarket tune on your engine and expect warranty coverage for any engine or drivetrain problem, your already screwed, so don't be naïve about it. Both the engines I popped were well within warranty time/miles limits, but I covered the costs (and do all my own work) because that's the right thing to do AND I don't trust dealer goons to get it right the way I want it again.

In the first case (my 2007 MazdaSpeed6 DISI 2.3) in 2011, I didn't fully understand the LSPI problem plus I had some wastegate control problems, so I didn't change my "formula" for results. When the second happened a bit over a year ago, there was plenty of info available for me to determine the root cause.

Now that I'm more knowledgeable, the new "fully built for ~800hp" engine going into the RS will have a much better chance to live a long life. I still won't run the 5w50 Motorcraft oil though, it will have a mix of 5w30 Redline & 5w30 SN+ oil. There's no reason to run w50 oil unless you're running flat out on a track for long periods, OR have a strong desire to fully utilize the Drift mode of your RS to destroy tires. Nothing wrong with that, but it's not me. All said, even built engines pop with LSPI, but with stronger aftermarket pistons, rods, etc. the results are usually "lifted" heads and blown head gaskets, NOT collapsed rods.

Well, I guess this was a bit more than a quick point, so...
 
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