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Subaru’s marketing doesn’t seem like it’s as good as Fords. With Ford, you’re likely to get questionable quality and almost nonexistent customer service but they can make a car that looks good to their customer base (eg Mustang gt500, focus rs, new bronco, Ranger raptor etc)

It doesn’t seem like Subaru do focus groups. They release a car, a lot of people don’t like it and then they spend years doing facelifts.
Surely it’d be easier just to ask a group of your existing customers whether they like your proposed design or not just to gauge interest from the beginning.
Although you’re totally right, we are not the kind of person they are targeting. They want a normal consumer. in the last 3 years,

  • my aunt sold her forester, got a crosstrek
  • friend got an ‘18 crosstrek, upgraded to ‘19
  • brother just got a forester sport
  • another aunt/uncle just got a forester
  • friend got a ‘19 crosstrek
  • family friends had a ‘13 crosstrek, upgraded to ‘20
  • friend picked up an outback
  • I happened to score a ‘10 sti

talking with them on their recent purchases, at the dealers their cars do not sit on the lot. They come in, they get sold, repeat. I was shocked when the crosstrek would only option a manual with the base model, and it seems to be the same with this new WRX. That should be proof enough they don’t much care for the enthusiast.

the 2022 STi will be a different beast, and that will really show whether they can still provide for the niche market, or give in to sales and offer it in an autotragic
 

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I think the last of the new 2021 WRX STIs are about to be snapped up quite quickly now that people know what the next model looks like.
Out of interest I checked the current version yesterday. Looks like we are out of new STI stock in AU
 

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I think the last of the new 2021 WRX STIs are about to be snapped up quite quickly now that people know what the next model looks like.
Out of interest I checked the current version yesterday. Looks like we are out of new STI stock in AU

I just checked my and there are 20 in San Diego area and some more are coming.

I can't see the STI as a replacement for my RS, but maybe as an addition?
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Although you’re totally right, we are not the kind of person they are targeting. They want a normal consumer. in the last 3 years,

  • my aunt sold her forester, got a crosstrek
  • friend got an ‘18 crosstrek, upgraded to ‘19
  • brother just got a forester sport
  • another aunt/uncle just got a forester
  • friend got a ‘19 crosstrek
  • family friends had a ‘13 crosstrek, upgraded to ‘20
  • friend picked up an outback
  • I happened to score a ‘10 sti

talking with them on their recent purchases, at the dealers their cars do not sit on the lot. They come in, they get sold, repeat. I was shocked when the crosstrek would only option a manual with the base model, and it seems to be the same with this new WRX. That should be proof enough they don’t much care for the enthusiast.

the 2022 STi will be a different beast, and that will really show whether they can still provide for the niche market, or give in to sales and offer it in an autotragic
How dare you imply that Focus RS owners aren’t normal?! Just because I have a corner of my garage dedicated to RS spares and consumables, always look back at my car when I park it, religiously check fluid levels and tyre pressures, use a trickle battery charger, double park to prevent others parking next to me ok fair point not normal.......

I have friends and family with Subaru SUVs also, and agree they seem to care more about how practical, reliable and safe the car is and less about the way it looks.

I hope they do better with the WRX STI but it’ll be pretty hard to turn a goose into an eagle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #25 ·
I just checked my and there are 20 in San Diego area and some more are coming.

I can't see the STI as a replacement for my RS, but maybe as an addition?
I don’t see anything as a replacement for my RS either. Hoping to keep mine long term, I’ve already had it for almost 5 years now.

There’s the Nissan Z, but it has that odd looking square front grille and I think it’s only a 2 seater.
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The new golf r is basically a more expensive Focus RS. Not even sure if it’ll come as a manual option in Australia.
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The 2022/23 WRX STI I was considering before Subaru did their reveal but I’m not so sure now.
 

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I dunno, I don't think it's horrid looking or that they failed miserably here.. it's just.. I dunno.. boring, to me.. like their focus (ahhhh see?! didn't mean to do that..) is on the EVs now and they just phoned this in.. The back end resembles a newer Camry, IMO.
 

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So disappointed. We were looking forward to the '22 WRX for my SO. Well, between the two of us we have a laundry list of complaints:
  • Still no hatch of course.
  • Plastic cladding on the exterior. So... much... cladding. The entire rear is just one giant piece of unpainted plastic. Wheel wells surrounded by plastic - why? It's just terrible. It's like they stole all the cues from ****ty generic CUVs.
  • Rear bumper bump - a stand-out of its own. WTF is going on with that rear bumper?
  • Infotainment - giant screen, too giant. Not just giant, but pointlessly so because...
  • HVAC is integrated into infotainment. The bottom section of the screen contains on-screen HVAC controls! They've removed physical controls to replace them by a permanent section on the screen. I guess that's better than the Golf R full-on integrating HVAC into the standard infotainment, but it suuuucks.
  • No physical controls for the HVAC because they are in the infotainment
  • Maybe lower trims can have a normal infotainment + HVAC? Nope! Lower trims get two screens. A top resembling the normal double-din infotainment, and a bottom which is the exact size of HVAC controls + traction controls and a couple other things that are normally just buttons.
  • Top trim, GT, is CVT-only
  • Subaru finally added an adjustable suspension, but it's GT-only, thus only CVT
  • CVT models get a newer more interesting and more modern AWD system that uses an electronically controlled adjustable limited slip center diff, as opposed to the manuals getting the old viscous fluid center diff. It's like a nerfed version of the STi DCCD system that allows front-back split adjustment. This adjustment is GT-only as well.
  • Recaro seats - the good ones - are GT-only of course as well! Because why not?!
  • Bottom trim is still key and not push-button in 2021 (personal pet peeve)
I'll give them some positives:
  • Manual hand brake! Holy crap, somebody did a normal handbrake when everyone else has electronics by now - even the Civic Type R
  • Steering wheel controls are all buttons instead of capacitives! Yay!

Basically, what I would have loved to see would be a hatch body with all the GT goodies (new AWD, adjustable ride and AWD, Recaro seats) in manual and with normal goddamn buttons. Of course, none of that is a thing.

In all, for all the "rah-rah we are saving the manuals" Subaru is doing, they are doing it in name only to cash in their built up following. They've locked all the new stuff behind their CVT models stringing the manual along pretending to care about their fanbase. What I really think is happening is that they want to get out of said fanbase into a "more mature" higher-end audience. They want more mass-market appeal from the WRX. My theory goes further that ideally they want to do CVT only because at this point manuals are a fraction of their production that they likely would prefer not to care about. By locking more and more features behind the CVT they can kick some people out of their brand while convincing others to rejoin on CVTs, and maybe gaining more traction with audiences who had not considered the WRX before. Over time this would allow Subaru to completely drop the manual citing "lack of demand" and consolidate production around CVTs.

We're kind of stuck now. The last choices for her were the R and the WRX. The '22 Golf R's interior is a crime against humanity, and the Subaru is all of the above. So now we may need to look for a CPO '20-'21 WRX, but that's probably a non-starter given the current market. A CPO Mk 7.5 Golf R is maybe a possibility, but Haldex by all accounts is bleh. The new R has an AWD system that is very similar to our R, but again with that interior... ffs.

So here's hoping that maybe somehow the GR Corolla delivers, but that's another year or two away at this point.
 
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I've liked the Levorg since it was introduced but I'm not holding any hope that Subaru will bring it to the US. And even when they did export it outside of Japan it was the less powerfull engine and if I remember correctly only with a CVT
 

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Apparently this is the new Subaru design language - they've "upgraded" the 2022 Outback to match - 2022 Subaru Outback Review, Pricing, and Specs
Mmm so rugged and tough, I can't even. hnngh...

Anyway, you can click through the years and it's so jarring how this plastic seems to be growing. At the current rate of growth the rest of the body should turn black plastic within the next 3-5 years. Just look at 2019 - no wheel well cladding, small flat rockers, fog-lights / bottom lip. 2020 the lip now juts out, and suddenly the wheel arches are black plastic. Rocker is now thicker too. 2021: 2020 but thicker. 2022: front cladding has now crept up all the way to the headlights, the wheel arches are now flaring out like a growth, and black cladding is noticeable spreading up the rear of the car. Logically, the fenders should just be all plastic in 2023 - 2024. Likely the entire rear fender. By 2025 it should start creeping up the doors. Who knows beyond that! 😆
 
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Agree with you on the styling. I think Subaru made better looking cars in the 90s. On paper the RS has this beat. WRX is only 271hp with 258lbft of torque.
It should be noted that the WRX is not competing with the RS, it's considered a segment below (~30k range) and compared against the GTI, Focus ST and Veloster N. The STI is the RS's natural rival along with the Golf R (and Type R, despite being FWD).
 

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Discussion Starter · #39 ·
So disappointed. We were looking forward to the '22 WRX for my SO. Well, between the two of us we have a laundry list of complaints:
  • Still no hatch of course.
  • Plastic cladding on the exterior. So... much... cladding. The entire rear is just one giant piece of unpainted plastic. Wheel wells surrounded by plastic - why? It's just terrible. It's like they stole all the cues from ****ty generic CUVs.
  • Rear bumper bump - a stand-out of its own. WTF is going on with that rear bumper?
  • Infotainment - giant screen, too giant. Not just giant, but pointlessly so because...
  • HVAC is integrated into infotainment. The bottom section of the screen contains on-screen HVAC controls! They've removed physical controls to replace them by a permanent section on the screen. I guess that's better than the Golf R full-on integrating HVAC into the standard infotainment, but it suuuucks.
  • No physical controls for the HVAC because they are in the infotainment
  • Maybe lower trims can have a normal infotainment + HVAC? Nope! Lower trims get two screens. A top resembling the normal double-din infotainment, and a bottom which is the exact size of HVAC controls + traction controls and a couple other things that are normally just buttons.
  • Top trim, GT, is CVT-only
  • Subaru finally added an adjustable suspension, but it's GT-only, thus only CVT
  • CVT models get a newer more interesting and more modern AWD system that uses an electronically controlled adjustable limited slip center diff, as opposed to the manuals getting the old viscous fluid center diff. It's like a nerfed version of the STi DCCD system that allows front-back split adjustment. This adjustment is GT-only as well.
  • Recaro seats - the good ones - are GT-only of course as well! Because why not?!
  • Bottom trim is still key and not push-button in 2021 (personal pet peeve)
I'll give them some positives:
  • Manual hand brake! Holy crap, somebody did a normal handbrake when everyone else has electronics by now - even the Civic Type R
  • Steering wheel controls are all buttons instead of capacitives! Yay!

Basically, what I would have loved to see would be a hatch body with all the GT goodies (new AWD, adjustable ride and AWD, Recaro seats) in manual and with normal goddamn buttons. Of course, none of that is a thing.

In all, for all the "rah-rah we are saving the manuals" Subaru is doing, they are doing it in name only to cash in their built up following. They've locked all the new stuff behind their CVT models stringing the manual along pretending to care about their fanbase. What I really think is happening is that they want to get out of said fanbase into a "more mature" higher-end audience. They want more mass-market appeal from the WRX. My theory goes further that ideally they want to do CVT only because at this point manuals are a fraction of their production that they likely would prefer not to care about. By locking more and more features behind the CVT they can kick some people out of their brand while convincing others to rejoin on CVTs, and maybe gaining more traction with audiences who had not considered the WRX before. Over time this would allow Subaru to completely drop the manual citing "lack of demand" and consolidate production around CVTs.

We're kind of stuck now. The last choices for her were the R and the WRX. The '22 Golf R's interior is a crime against humanity, and the Subaru is all of the above. So now we may need to look for a CPO '20-'21 WRX, but that's probably a non-starter given the current market. A CPO Mk 7.5 Golf R is maybe a possibility, but Haldex by all accounts is bleh. The new R has an AWD system that is very similar to our R, but again with that interior... ffs.

So here's hoping that maybe somehow the GR Corolla delivers, but that's another year or two away at this point.
There’s also the Honda Civic type r due next year (spy photos below), but Honda’s styling has been a bit hit and miss over the years. I liked the look of the 1990s NSX.
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There’s also the Honda Civic type r due next year (spy photos below), but Honda’s styling has been a bit hit and miss over the years. I liked the look of the 1990s NSX.
Ha, doesn't everyone? It only gets more beloved as time goes on, and their skyrocketing values on the used car market reflect that. You should check out Integra Type R prices too. 90s Honda was overflowing with innovative ideas and the cash to make them a reality.

The 2022 Type R will probably be plainer than the current version, yet somehow uglier due to how unattractive the 11th gen Civic is. But it will no doubt be a phenomenal car. Honda has really put all of their heart and soul into that drivetrain and it shows. I can't say the same for Subaru.
 
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